Cat Scratch Fever

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Must love dogs: it’s a rallying cry, and a warning to all ye enter here. Today’s episode is all about animals. June has survived a weekend cohabitating with cats, and Jess has wild information to share about feline evolution. Plus, an exciting update on Bingo!



June Diane Raphael, Jessica St. Clair

Jessica St. Clair  01:54

Hi, I’m Jessica St. Clair.


June Diane Raphael  01:56

And I’m June Diane Raphael, and this is The Deep Dive.


Jessica St. Clair  02:00

We’re about to do what women have done for centuries. We are crowding around the fire with our generous hunches. We got babies hanging off our tips and we’re going to share with you our fears.


June Diane Raphael  02:11

That’s right.


Jessica St. Clair  02:12

Our joy, our tips on how to stay alive.


June Diane Raphael  02:16

Now Jes, we’re heating a call that no one has made.


Jessica St. Clair  02:20

Not a soul.


June Diane Raphael  02:21

But you’re invited to listen.


Jessica St. Clair  02:22

Absolutely, because we make one promise and one promise only we will not Google a thing because frankly, we’re too damn tired. Please get ready to go on The Deep Dive.


June Diane Raphael  02:40

Hi, Jessica.


Jessica St. Clair  02:42

Hello, June.


June Diane Raphael  02:45

How are you? What is going on?


Jessica St. Clair  02:48

I got COVID and my child sick. She doesn’t have COVID, just another cold.


June Diane Raphael  02:57

I’m so confused.


Jessica St. Clair  03:00

Me too, turns out when I was talking about my low energy levels last week, it was because I was avec COVID and I didn’t realize it, so here we are.


June Diane Raphael  03:18

Here we are, so to face a couple.


Jessica St. Clair  03:23

I don’t even know at this point and this is not a medical podcast, but like do you I thought they just lifted the quarantines. I don’t know man, you know, honestly, does anyone really let us out of our homes during the day anyway? It’s like where am I going?


June Diane Raphael  03:39



Jessica St. Clair  03:40

I wasn’t asked to the Vanity Fair Oscar party.


June Diane Raphael  03:43



Jessica St. Clair  03:45

But yeah, you know it is, I wish honestly I’d known earlier so I could have like you got empathy talked about it more gotten out of more things you know hold but.


June Diane Raphael  04:02

That’s when it’s like to not be able to use it for its greater good, you know, is a really upsetting.


Jessica St. Clair  04:10

Quarantine, like, I would have been over in that GC by myself. But by the time I realized that the damage was done.


June Diane Raphael  04:16

Right, we’ve already done all of our exposure.


Jessica St. Clair  04:20

Imagine if I was over there. I would have been de couponing right now I would have been like, living my best. Oh god this I wouldn’t be stenciling I would have gotten out stencils.


June Diane Raphael  04:31

Oh my God, Jess, I’m sorry […] You’re not feeling well.


Jessica St. Clair  04:37

No, I’m actually okay now. I think I realized at the tail end of it. I don’t know guy.


June Diane Raphael  04:43

Well, I am you know, it’s was shocking to get the text that you had COVID on know what to do. It was just like interesting […]. I it’s so weird, like I have actually been processing a lot of delayed COVID grief. And this podcast is a COVID response podcast. It’s endemic response. We’re on the frontline, you know, it is a pandemic, it’s like it is an absolute response backlash on what you want to call it to the pandemic.


Jessica St. Clair  05:16

It’s true actually, so much of our podcast is motivated by member, the first couple episodes, you talked about wanting to go to a fuck cut.


June Diane Raphael  05:27

I know and I never got to.


Jessica St. Clair  05:29

I think that’s out of the cards for us, unfortunately. Even though so many people we know are doing Strato work.


June Diane Raphael  05:37

I know, and I you know, the fuck hut of my dreams for all of those new listeners was like, I was feeling so crazy and so isolated, like so isolated, that I did want us to all do a bunch of drugs. And when I say us, I do mean, everyone.


Jessica St. Clair  05:56

Yeah, as a collective as an idea. And I think that would have been a right response.


June Diane Raphael  06:02

And I wanted I wanted it.


Jessica St. Clair  06:03

For adults.


June Diane Raphael  06:05

Obviously, a hot where we could all do but like a beautifully designed hut, where we would all do mushrooms and the like nothing that’s like potentially going to be laced with fentanyl, like no.


Jessica St. Clair  06:19

Nothing that’s going to make us render us insane for.


June Diane Raphael  06:22

No, just like a real you know, mushrooms. Stuff that grows in the ground. And then we would walk in and.


Jessica St. Clair  06:32

Covered in sheepskin, it would be covered in like animal I know that you’re vegan, of course, but different animal skins. You know, it should feel like Game of Thrones in a way in a way.


June Diane Raphael  06:44

So then we would all and we, is.


Jessica St. Clair  06:48

Like I don’t know is in we.


June Diane Raphael  06:51

But you’d you’d have sex with whoever was there. Okay, a man woman doesn’t matter.


Jessica St. Clair  07:00

Okay, you’re saying hi.


June Diane Raphael  07:02

This out and you get out putting away. And then this is what’s so important is that you walk out. And whatever has happened inside there. Maybe you find a new partner who knows but what happens in the fuck 1,000%, and then you walk out and you’re just a little bit more resolved your little bit. You’ve healed a little bit. And yeah, that’s my you know, that’s my big. Oh my god, I have to tell you this is so so upsetting, but I.


Jessica St. Clair  07:39

So I do feel like I’m having some delayed because we have no rituals because we we barely have any healing around this. It’s just like, you know, million we have I don’t know what the fuck is going on? And we haven’t been out on the pickleball court and so long and that was a real touchstone for me. And I think that children have ruined that obviously for us, you know, their their activities have taken away more joy from us than from the little that was left. And so that’s a bummer. You know that either bummer.


June Diane Raphael  08:14

That was another healing space.


Jessica St. Clair  08:17

It was, no for real.


June Diane Raphael  08:21

So my so so yeah, so there’s been like some delayed grief for me but also like thinking about that time you know, like Gus said something in their day where he’s like, he said something about certain homework and he was like, yeah, it was during COVID when we were in Canada, and I was like, that was like Tony, that literally like don’t even mention that the fact that you have a memory of that is so disturbing to me.


Jessica St. Clair  08:50

They do.


June Diane Raphael  08:51

Or dark days. I also wanted to share with you that something major has happened deep divers and I’m excited to announce it to Jessica, my family doesn’t know the children don’t know this yet boy decided yesterday that we are officially adopting Bingo.


Jessica St. Clair  09:13

Oh, I’ve been waiting for this news. You keep saying Foster and every time it’s like you don’t wait for the Academy. We need to have a ceremony of some sort to welcome him to the academy, sash around.


June Diane Raphael  09:31

Listen, I’m all about creating ritual create making meaning making meaning and so yes, I think I think something needs to be done thank you, Jessica. I’m so excited to tell the kids Paul’s been away when it comes back or until the kids oh, here’s what’s interesting now. For those of you new listeners who don’t remember my other dog Meatball, please know that Meatball told us in no uncertain terms. When it was time for him to go, right, okay.


Jessica St. Clair  10:04

He was ready to stand down. Sergeant meatball was his full name.


June Diane Raphael  10:08

That’s right. A member of the armed forces, yeah. And the way he did it, so I’ve been working on our backyard, which had like, finally took on as a concept as a place like, yeah, I needed to deal with.


Jessica St. Clair  10:23

Dirt pit for a while


June Diane Raphael  10:24

it was a pit that was yet so. So once it was done, actually, we put a pool in once everything was done. And it’s a tiered backyard. So like you had to go down and Meatball was already struggling with stairs. And once we were as a family in that pool, and he saw us down there in the pool together, that was the day that he walked away.


Jessica St. Clair  10:51

The first time he’s ever walked away from his post.


June Diane Raphael  10:54

Oh, he’s never left this house. I mean, I told the story before but I, you know, the one time that like the gate was open, we would leave the backyard gate open. He’d never ever leave. But one time, the gate was open. He couldn’t find us. And he I panicked because I couldn’t find him. And I started run out the front door. The motherfucker was sitting at the door. Yeah, that’s right and lying down in front of him. And he walked away. So he wasn’t going anywhere. Except for that day. He saw us there, and all the gates, I didn’t. I thought all the gates were open but again, this dog never left. And all of a sudden, you know, half an hour later a woman comes running into the backyard saying like, do you have a dog and english bulldog? He’s like two blocks away. Okay, so that was my sign that he was trying to find like a Viking. It was like a Viking General. Okay, they just walk. They just sail away when it’s their time.


Jessica St. Clair  11:56

Yeah, that’s right.


June Diane Raphael  11:57

They don’t want to be a burden to the community. A lot of Native American tribes do this as well. They just sort of the elders walk out.


Jessica St. Clair  12:06



June Diane Raphael  12:09

And Meatball left, and so yesterday, it’s like Bingos been such a Bingos been in that backyard so much, he’s such as he’s it’s his space, you know, we’re down there we’re playing is playing another dogs he’s, it’s his domain. And I started to think back on that moment of Meatball looking at us and I think he saw those steps you know, down because of course, we have stepped down to the first level of backyard we have steps in our house we have steps in and then we were craving stuff second level. And I think he saw them and said, no.


Jessica St. Clair  12:54

That’s a […] dogs game.


June Diane Raphael  12:55

It’s yeah, and I’ve just felt so I’ve been thinking about him so much, just this is the thing about grief right? It’s like, you think you’re done or you think you’re like oh, I’m resolved and then to be taken all I have been thinking every time I’m down there with Bingo I pictures face through the slats of the fence looking down at us. And I’m just like, and then I felt so badly oh my god, I’m sorry. We didn’t have a way for you to get down here like I just.


Jessica St. Clair  13:33

Know you’re really it’s so interesting how the brain like tries to find like some reason why you’re sad. It’s like no, I’m just I yeah, I miss it. You know, you miss him. Think about when you cross over how all the all the psychics and mediums say the same thing that is who greets you. All not just psychics and mediums my friend but hospice nurses who have witnessed 1000s of death.


June Diane Raphael  13:59



Jessica St. Clair  14:00

You didn’t know that?


June Diane Raphael  14:01



Jessica St. Clair  14:01

Hospice nurses hospital.


June Diane Raphael  14:03

What did they say?


Jessica St. Clair  14:05

They say that there’s I felt, you know, I follow mainly.


June Diane Raphael  14:09

Yeah, of course.


Jessica St. Clair  14:10

Like, that’s why that’s where my algorithms that and there’s just I mean, hospice care. I mean, they’re just such wonderful people. And, but this one woman hospice nurse, Penny, talks about how there will the process of dying in general and she tries to destigmatize it and like things that are very natural that happen and, you know, the family is sometimes like, you shouldn’t you know, they’re diabetic, should they should they have ice cream? And she’s like, yeah, they should have fucking whatever they want, you know, and how actually, like, the body’s primed to become dehydrated, you know, and it’s, it’s very, very fascinating and, you know, and, but one of the things and how, like, there’s often this final rally that happens where read before the body really does let go. But she talks about how many people are greeted by their pets. And so they will be looking up and see they’ll have visions of their pets coming for them before they die, this is documented this, like me, I swear that their pets their comfort items, I can’t first matters to show up to walk them through.


June Diane Raphael  15:35

Like I can’t imagine anything better.


Jessica St. Clair  15:38

Truly, truly.


June Diane Raphael  15:41

And then you think about them being angels on this earth. And that’s what they are. They’re pure love bombs. That’s all they are. I know they’re they all they do is make us happy.


Jessica St. Clair  16:00

They know dopamine. I mean, I can’t. Well, I’m coming over Bebe and I are coming over with Cookie now that it’s official. And Bingo can meet you know, her. Her niece, her cousin, second cousin from the west side.


June Diane Raphael  16:18

So funny, Bingo has been misgendered left and right. It’s so unknown to me.


Jessica St. Clair  16:24

I know.


June Diane Raphael  16:25

Nobody ever Mr. Know or a lady.


Jessica St. Clair  16:29

But bingo has a feminine and masculine energy and it is. It’s a masculine battle, like the masculine. Yeah, he’s really, he’s really bored, the Gen Z. He’s like, whatever is below that.


June Diane Raphael  16:44

That’s him saying he’s a new manifestation of gender that we have yet to understand. We’re going to know where to fucking god just because this dog has, you know, he has one pale blue eye and one brown eye. There’s something about he’s, he’s holding both. He’s both sides now.


Jessica St. Clair  17:05

Like seal, you know, he’s like, the artists seal. And he’s always wearing a jaunty scarf. You know, I just like, I don’t know, who’s putting those scarfs on him. But you know, it’s really something and he’s so cute. And I’m just so happy for your family. And you know, the other thing that is just so wild about pets is they all have such different personalities. So to go from an old dog to a young energy is a wild thing and it’s but it’s also renewal in spring and.


June Diane Raphael  17:37

Can I tell you something, Jess, and I’m sorry, I’m sorry our deep divers it Bingo is now in the background wanting to play so badly. So please excuse the noise but what’s so interesting. Oh, did you see that? I tried to throw something in it hit the wall. So what’s so interesting is that my sister’s jog Otto who was about four but he was a puppy puppy like pup, puppy, and he you know, Meatball was always an elder statesman with him. And meatball, really, you know, taught him how to behave a few times. And that tablished his boundaries. And so like when Otto is in the house, I don’t want to play so badly with me bone was so interested. And Meatball would just be like, you know, that’s not for me. I just like your children. You didn’t like playing?


June Diane Raphael  18:34

I don’t play.


June Diane Raphael  18:36

I don’t and I stand fucking behind that.


June Diane Raphael  18:38

For our new listeners, Jude doesn’t play.


June Diane Raphael  18:41

I don’t play with children. I’m an adult […].


Jessica St. Clair  18:45

But that maybe […] you so much as she always says June speaks to me like I am an adult and I appreciate that because she feels that she is one already just know she said I really appreciate it June speaks to me as an adult. When you weigh on in her in on her outfits is as if you you know you’re at the Vanity Fair party saying love what is this designer?


June Diane Raphael  19:06

Well, I also do think Jess, I mean I think that I’m really there’s certain things I play I play a card game I’ll actually do Legos and I will play sports. But I don’t you’re not going to find me like, let’s sit here and draw together or lead leave me.  I get paid to do that okay, that should doesn’t come for free. Hold on one second, let me occupy him with something I’ll be right back, okay.


June Diane Raphael  22:46



Jessica St. Clair  22:47



June Diane Raphael  22:47

I’m so sorry for like I’ve been talking just nonstop and I’m going to be done with this but I just want to tell you one other thing exciting but it’s also yes you’re right it is the circle of life because because now so my dog nephew Otto he’s always sort of Meatball was always was always letting him know what time it was, and then yesterday because I knew it adopted him I said let’s bring it over let’s have a playdate and bingo I wanted to play with so badly with Otto.


Jessica St. Clair  23:28

Otto had to tell him what time it was.


June Diane Raphael  23:30

When he did and I was like holy shit it and I know the divers I’m sorry if this is all so insanely, but it really blew my mind, I was like, if that’s not the circle of life, my life’s a circle.


Jessica St. Clair  23:48

Joni says Deborah Terry […]


June Diane Raphael  23:53

Days keep going round […] Okay, I don’t want to, but it really, really, like really affected me really impacted me. I was like, what am I witnessing? Because Otto was always the puppy energy in the playful. And then honestly, what what I have really had to confront was how sad I was for Bingo that he would play with him pathetic.


Jessica St. Clair  24:23

Well, it’s just like when I brought cookie down to you know, there’s a cocktail hour that happens for the small dogs in Santa Monica and they all go down and run free, even though it’s illegal. And you know, Cookie has a hard time because she’s preyed upon by most of the male dogs and so she was trying to keep her butthole firmly on the ground. And then they were getting into her ear select they’ll try to get any you know, anything they can from her. Yeah, and I don’t know why she’s such catnip,


June Diane Raphael  24:54

But you know, just it’s just I don’t know that I’ve ever felt to see Bingo. got rejected and what I will give him and as interesting to watch as my brother in law said he’s like, this is just like they’re talking to each other they are this is my language. And I was like, absolutely. I can’t I’m not a dog, I’m not I loved animals. I am not I didn’t grow up with this.


Jessica St. Clair  25:17

Shouldn’t be anything in your life. This shouldn’t be a part of your personality and yet it is now.


June Diane Raphael  25:24

It is, Jess, I don’t know, did you? Did you grow up with animals?


Jessica St. Clair  25:29

No, it was a cat family.


June Diane Raphael  25:31

Oh, I didn’t know that.


Jessica St. Clair  25:34

Two cats always. And now they’re named after my. They’re always named weirdly after my my grandfather had a cat named after himself. And now we have a cat. They have a cat named after him as well.


June Diane Raphael  25:53

It was so weird, are you a cat person?


Jessica St. Clair  25:56

Yes, I do love cats and I did spend I’ve spent many weekends at the cat cafe Yes, I was originally a cat person. It was this it was the only animal I could get my hands on and I and yes and I love them and and we have one of our deep divers has a beautiful rescue called sorry, the Caddyshack and she says she sends BB lots of merch and but yes, but does it isn’t that strange that my grandfather named a cat after himself at Thomas our kitty cat. […]


June Diane Raphael  26:33

About us just like passing on his legacy.


Jessica St. Clair  26:36

That’s strange. It’s strange as hell in our herd. Then we named it after that. Uh huh.


June Diane Raphael  26:42

Can I tell you I had an experience with a cat this weekend that left me rattled.


Jessica St. Clair  26:49



June Diane Raphael  26:51

So I this is so complicated, and again for our new deep divers. I really apologize today’s an animal podcast. It is an animal episode. So I had fostered a different Pitbull, you know who I’m talking about?


Jessica St. Clair  27:07



June Diane Raphael  27:08

Who won that got away in the witness protection program? Yeah, and I was fostering the softball for one of my best friends. We had her for a month and a half. We all were really in love with her.


Jessica St. Clair  27:23

The good old days


June Diane Raphael  27:25

As my son would say those were the good old days. So it was very hard to let her go. But it was beautiful, too. So we went this weekend. Me and the boys we drove to San Diego on Saturday morning to go visit both my best friend her wife and their dog, that we had we had spend time with now. I forgot I was almost halfway there. And I thought they have two cats. And I didn’t have any clarity, I’m really allergic to cats. Okay, so it’s not like I don’t like cats, I can’t like cat. It’s available to me, they hurt me cat’s great.


Jessica St. Clair  28:09



June Diane Raphael  28:11

So I really didn’t declare it and I said, man, you gotta go out and get some and she’s like, okay, okay. And the other issue I was like, I swear to you Jess, every cat I encounter wants to be with me.


Jessica St. Clair  28:23

Yeah, they know the ones that don’t like them and then they have to make it their business […] Exactly they get you do have an interest in cat energy. Now that you know you don’t like me, I’ll spend my whole life trying to get you to like, that’s my MO.


June Diane Raphael  28:43

So I arrived now their house is beautiful, right by the ocean ocean breeze, I’m like, I walk in. I’m like, oh, actually, I’m okay. I’m gonna took a clarinet, but I was like, this isn’t as bad. Not a lot of carpets. I’m like, I’m okay, and I see the cats. And we’re staying over there. And I’m like, okay, like they don’t announce like they’re not interested in humans at all. And I’m like, okay. So we go through the day or out and about we have a beautiful dinner at the house. I’m fine. Cats are not anywhere near us. Okay, then, it’s time to go to bed. Now Gus is also allergic to cats. Okay, that’s a part of this, also on clarinet. And when I tell you this cat, whose name I couldn’t I still don’t know because I just couldn’t commit it to memory. This large black cat was so heavy. Okay, I’ve never seen such a heavy cat.


Jessica St. Clair  29:43

Well, now you’re fat shaming this cat.


June Diane Raphael  29:44

I’m sorry.


Jessica St. Clair  29:45

It’s not right.


June Diane Raphael  29:46

It was just heavy to the ground. Big, thick, thick presence. So I go to sleep with both kids in the bed with me, doors closed. Then I meant I wanted to come out and do some more time with my friend but I actually fell asleep with the kids that I wake up. It’s like, one of the morning and I’m like, Oh God, I gotta do my skincare gotta do my stuff. Now I walk out. I walk out of the room. That motherfucker. It’s sitting in the middle of the hallway staring at me. And I’m like, oh.


Jessica St. Clair  30:27

Because that’s when they come to life, they’re not. Okay, I want to talk about the fact that they’re nocturnal.


June Diane Raphael  30:33

[…] That I just understood that this weekend. Yeah, so hunt […]


Jessica St. Clair  30:41

Was raising you stalking you.


June Diane Raphael  30:43

Okay, so I’m like, Oh, God, but the bathroom is right there. So I just I don’t even have to go past him. I just go right into the bathroom. I close the door, do my stuff. I come back out. Gets out there, oh my god. It was that I know. I had left at the door to our bedroom open. Okay, Jessica. I see, I go into the bath. I go into back into that and other kids are sleeping. And I see on the far side of the bed, okay, by the windows. I see, not its body just its head poking out from the bed from behind the bed. And I’m like, oh fuck, and I got ey.


Jessica St. Clair  31:33

Like, you became like a British lorry driver?


June Diane Raphael  31:36

Oh, boy, what are you doing?


Jessica St. Clair  31:39

You can’t chase a cat?


June Diane Raphael  31:42

You can’t, well, turns out you can’t. And also, it’s and then as I’m saying, boy, to this cat. It slowly retreats behind the bed. I can’t see it now. And Gus is like half naked, splayed out on the bed. And I’m like, what do I do? What do I do? And so I made such a difficult decision to sacrifice my children. I left the door open to that room in the hopes I almost shut the door closed. But I was like, I have to give this cat a chance to get out of the room. And then I went into man’s office and I slept on a tiny couch. Okay, tiny leather couch. Office was the only other place that had a door like where I could close myself in a way.


Jessica St. Clair  32:30

So you sacrifice Gus thinking, well, maybe he’ll make it through breathing and maybe not. But I have to get out of here and you left them with that cat?


June Diane Raphael  32:40

I did, I left them with that.


Jessica St. Clair  32:42

That’s funny.


June Diane Raphael  32:43

That I didn’t know I don’t know how to tame a cat.


Jessica St. Clair  32:47

No, if you’re if you don’t speak Catlin, as you don’t know.


June Diane Raphael  32:50

And when I tell you, Jess, and people say this about cats, but boy was a true. When I saw it peeking that bed. The energy was like, I got you bitch, I got you. Okay, and then it moved away. It was like it was game over for me and.


Jessica St. Clair  33:13

It in owns you. They are not afraid they don’t, they’re not afraid of anything. And you know that there is and this is? Again, why is this an animal podcast but cats are a huge problem in Los Angeles because they have like 1 million kittens a year. So there will always be more cats than people always there are so many cats. You’re living amongst, like not more Yang’s people have wild cats in Los Angeles, they’ve taken over it’s kind of a thing. They don’t know what to do. And you know why there’s more black and tabby cats. Again, I’ve spent so much time at this cat cafe where you just lay around.


June Diane Raphael  33:54

No, but Jess, let me ask you something seriously, I want to know why there’s more black in, and I didn’t know that.


Jessica St. Clair  33:59

They camouflage, they’re the ones who survived because in the in the night. Black and Tabby is camouflage. So that’s why there’s more of them than the other cars. They’re creatures of the night. That’s the truth.


June Diane Raphael  34:14

And I didn’t know that, and Nancy said that in the morning, she’s like, yeah, they’re well they’re nocturnal. Like goddamn I didn’t know cats are nocturnal. Why would you ever domesticate a pet that’s nocturnal.


Jessica St. Clair  34:24

Ask the Egyptians. I mean, this is a tale as old as time they’ve been around, you know, they’ve they are perfectly evolved. They have not evolved at all since the Egyptian times. That’s the cat that the Egyptians had we have now. Okay, I don’t want to know this.


June Diane Raphael  34:41

Like, are you suggesting that we’ve evolved around cats like they’ve stayed the same and we changes?


Jessica St. Clair  34:50

Yes, they’re the perfect machine. And when I tell you my dad is so obsessed with his cat, Thomas R Two, T two so that, you know, my family was having a particularly difficult Christmas as you know. And I came downstairs and my dad was in the basement, which is his office covered of course and posters of playing house that I don’t even know where he got them from. And he was playing Pink Floyd to his cat Tasar he said he really enjoys this album. Okay, so like, it’s takes, he’s at he’s 18 and I just looked at him over Christmas and I said, you motherfucker, you got to stay alive for at least another year.


June Diane Raphael  35:43

18? Cats live that long?


Jessica St. Clair  35:49

It can live to like 22 and we hope he does I go I don’t care if I have to like Weekend at Bernie’s you were like what, but like this cat whilst we are in the underworld as a collective St. Clair tribe, this cat must stay alive. And he’s given us some scares, and so I just honestly he goes down the rest of the ship goes to.


June Diane Raphael  39:35

It’s so fascinating to me that now I’m just like understanding your that you like cats and actually kind of are a cat.


Jessica St. Clair  40:32

I do, I’m not nocturnal. Certainly you’re right. I’m not a dog.


June Diane Raphael  40:39

No, I’m.


Jessica St. Clair  40:39

Just like I just a gator. Yeah, you are you’re I don’t know.


June Diane Raphael  40:46



Jessica St. Clair  40:47

But that’s the funny thing about cats is like, and that’s why you’re such a cat. It’s because they’re so there’s so slippery.


June Diane Raphael  40:58

Dan and I moved to LA. We lived in an a not so savory part of of Santa Monica actually. And we were true, we were so depressed that we tried to go for a walk. It was at night probably like 9:30, we didn’t have kids yet. And all of a sudden a black furry one of those like gigantic, lots of fur, jumped out of a hedge. And where and again, this is where you know what you’re dealing with Dan screamed, run for your life and took off. And I was very far behind him. He didn’t know what it was. But it was very much a save yourself scenario. And I was like that’s like that, that that movie that Will Ferrell and Julia Louis Dreyfus remade where the avalanche came. I was like you fucking took off. You didn’t know what that thing was.


Jessica St. Clair  41:47

Well, I understand those instincts. He’s allergic he hates them.


June Diane Raphael  41:52

That he missed me that seem as if he took off I’ve never seen so fast. I left my child who’s also allergic in the middle of the night. We didn’t even have the wherewithal to say like, hey, Gus, come sleep over here. Like I was just like, I’m added here, I’m out of here.


Jessica St. Clair  42:10

People also don’t get it like I’m not trying to be like, difficult. I simply can’t breathe in this home and my parents were like, take a Benadryl like, they don’t care. They’re like they had comes first.


June Diane Raphael  42:23

A little bit like people don’t really know you’ve just how alerting.


Jessica St. Clair  42:27

It’s like an anti histamine response. It’s not your body is in distress.


June Diane Raphael  42:33

Oh, I have no control over it. When I was in when I was in middle school, I went over to my friend a marina, what’s his house she had cats. And I didn’t this is when I found out I was alert. I pet the cat and then I rubbed my eye.


Jessica St. Clair  42:45

Couldn’t see it.


June Diane Raphael  42:46

And I literally had to go to the ER because my eye blew up, so frightening. So I’m just I can’t be around them for extended periods of time without a lot of medication. But, but Jess, you know.


Jessica St. Clair  43:02

I bet my nan was just like, I bet your best friend was like, oh, yeah, they’re nocturnal, like, oh, no big deal. Like you had to sleep on a couch like yeah, that’s okay. They own the place.


June Diane Raphael  43:11

No, listen, she felt really she was absolutely mortified that I slept on the couch and she married into cats. Okay, I wouldn’t, she married into cats, so what can you do about that? Nothing, but I just, I guess what I want to ask you though, is when you’re hanging around your family cats. are you connecting with them?


Jessica St. Clair  43:32

Yes, they were all I had they were close the closest I could get to a dog so like our our cats. And again our cats are like, you know get get Pink Floyd played to them so they’re much more like dogs in that way that they connect to you. But we’ve had to like warm up to Thomas R Two like for years and years before he like accepted us. You know, it wasn’t until I moved into the basement of my parents house last summer quite randomly that he fully embraced us as part of the tribe. So I don’t know what to tell you. I mean, I’ll get I’ll take an animal however, I can get my hands on them but interesting, you don’t have cats, is that just because of damn. Because the day he couldn’t breathe? Believe me, I’ve tried to bring them in the house? Of course I have, and he’s like, do you care more about them than me? Like that’s why I can’t breathe. Please somebody take me seriously.


June Diane Raphael  44:23

Believe me, believe men, and believe women.


Jessica St. Clair  44:29

Believe me.


June Diane Raphael  44:31

Jess, did I ever tell the story about my friend who’s whose mother works for the Houston Zoo and they always had a boa constrictor. So many crazy amount of the ferret that I adopted, I told you about that in college.


Jessica St. Clair  44:42



June Diane Raphael  44:43

Yeah, but when I was at and then we were unfit mothers and she had to take the ferret but I was in her bathroom or parents bathroom when I was visiting Houston. And I was on the toilet and I heard [..]  And I was like, the fuck something’s breathing in here. And I looked down and it was Mr. T the tortoise. He was like 95 years old, and he was staring up at me going […] Like, that big fucking just is everywhere in the house, you never know.


Jessica St. Clair  45:30



June Diane Raphael  45:32

So the animals are. I mean, honestly, if I could be around them every minute of the day, it’s all I want.


Jessica St. Clair  45:40

I know and I love.


June Diane Raphael  45:42

You’re so beautifully connected to them. I mean, it’s very interesting, because like, I will tell you, I mean this very deeply, you know, I’ve now been fostering […] foster fail adopting to pretty, like decently sized pitbulls. And nothing is like made me nervous. And the way that I’ve been absolutely terrified of cats and their energy, you know, on our old house, Jess, we had like, remember, there was sort of that, like, outside part when you walked in there was like, that little atrium area. I walked in one day and there was a cat there. And I was like, oh, fucking hell no. And I left the door open and I ran to into the house from the back. And then I came to the front, the little french doors, and I looked out and that cat is sitting at the door waiting. And I’m like, and it didn’t leave for such a long time. And I was taking pictures sending it to Paul. I’m like, get it out, get it out. Someone’s gone texting the neighbors who lost a cat there’s a cat here. No color, and finally and but in that moment, I genuinely was like, we must move like there’s no if this cat, it’s home.


Jessica St. Clair  47:06

Comfortable picking up and leaving. It’s very disturbing to me.


June Diane Raphael  47:09

I was so ready to be like, this is it, we’re out of here […] Eventually, our neighbor like directed me to a woman whose cat it was but it was so frightening to see that level of like, I fucking own you bitch.


Jessica St. Clair  47:26

Yes it does they do own again, they also don’t need to come inside. And you remember the woman who put the ice caps on me when I was going through treatment Gail, she had 51 cats she lived with and Lenin was gotten so involved in Gail’s cat rescue, she trapped on, she trapped the wild ones and we would you know from the wild because that’s why it’s such a problem, they’re having so many kittens in the wild. But she had names for all of them. And so one time I would go to sleep they would give me so many drugs that I would fall asleep. And I literally woke up to Lenin writing all of their names on a on an envelope and she was like number 49 Katy Perry,  number 50 Mr. Mustapha Lee’s number 52, and I was like, what are you doing? She’s like, I just get involved. I get involved in all of their dramas who’s got mange who’s you know? But what it loves I mean but this woman was an angel on earth angel on earth.


June Diane Raphael  47:30

To be clear wish the best for cats.


Jessica St. Clair  48:31

Yeah, I’m again I’m ruled by them so it’s like I’m also I want people I know people are gonna be upset about it, but it’s also like cat energy. I’m just like they’re dictators you know, this is an oppressive regime but I’m I don’t I don’t wish harm upon them I just I’m you know, struggling with my own sovereignty. This podcast is so stupid.


June Diane Raphael  49:04

Why are they what else? What else?


Jessica St. Clair  49:10

What else do we have, you know? Oh, what else got so much work to do between now and the end of March.


June Diane Raphael  49:19

Kind of feel that way. I’m just racing towards summer.


Jessica St. Clair  49:23

Yes, got so much work to do. And I’m trying to chip away at it and not get overwhelmed by it. Very hard chop wood carry water. Dan is a chop wood carry water. He doesn’t get overwhelmed by deadlines or whatever. I think I have such all or nothing thinking, I’m like, there’s a deadline. It’s like college lets everybody live in the house. And we’ll order in until it’s done until three weeks from now. So I’m really trying to do something different but boy, oh boy.


June Diane Raphael  49:58

You know it the time change has not helped us. I’ve been single parenting for the last few days, and I’m the time change. I know it’s this looks so simple right sour but it’s like it really seems to have gotten us pretty good over here.


Jessica St. Clair  50:16

Oh, for sure, you know also for me because the sunshine is such a it’s beckoning me at 5:45 Yesterday, I was like, fuck it, let’s head down, bring the dogs down. He’s like Dan like it’s dinner time. I’m like, is it though? It’s not, and so everyone’s up till nine. You know, it’s like it’s a disaster over here in that way and so.


June Diane Raphael  50:37

But I love that.


Jessica St. Clair  50:38

I do, it summer already. For me, I’m like, Oh, enough is enough with the number.


June Diane Raphael  50:43

Let’s wrap it up.


June Diane Raphael  50:45

Let’s wrap it up. It’s time for summer, and then let’s head into the holidays because this over this.


June Diane Raphael  50:52

I will say as much as the time change is hard. There’s something about it being light. At 6, 6:37 one close to seven. That is so wonderful.


Jessica St. Clair  51:08

Tumbler time you get free service over at 5:30 in the dark.


June Diane Raphael  51:12

No, you can’t. So I know people want to lose the tie.


Jessica St. Clair  51:18

No, I don’t I need it. I need this bump, I honestly I needed to signal the time of renewal I do I need it. I need it as a little bump. For me, this is for me, I take this time change very personally. And I feel like it’s for me.


June Diane Raphael  51:36

You know what has been really centering me and I don’t think we can do it this week. But we will be back is our academy happy hours now for those of you don’t know, we’ve been hosting these happy hours on Fridays for our students at the Academy. And we do it on Instagram Live and it’s really fun. And it’s just been God is it like really launched me into the weekend. And I’ve just really been enjoying it, Jess.


Jessica St. Clair  52:03

Me too, it’s a ritual too, it’s like Friday, now we do it at 3pm. Now part of it is that we get to knock off now we we did have quite a few drinks, and then we went back to work at four which was.


June Diane Raphael  52:15

That was a mistake. I’m going to try to handle my schedule, so that doesn’t happen.


Jessica St. Clair  52:19

But it’s so fun to just have a drink and go oh, it’s the weekend like what is the weekend hold for us, you know, because I think also with kids and all of their activities. It can be a bit of a grind, you know?  But the weekends are time for you know, frivolous activity, you know?


June Diane Raphael  52:40

I just tell you, so I can I know I’m going back to animals, but I did go in San Diego where I went this weekend. We went to a dog beach.


Jessica St. Clair  52:52

Okay, yeah, San Diego. Nobody’s trying too hard down there. Do you know what I mean?


June Diane Raphael  52:59

It’s so true.


Jessica St. Clair  53:00

They are living is easy down there. It’s easy down there, yes.


June Diane Raphael  53:07

Yes, now, you know, Paul obviously did a whole show that I did with him called NTSF SD SUV, which stood for National Strike For San Diego Sportster Utility Vehicle but there were a lot of San Diego jokes. And they were just just about that pretty much which was like, why is San Diego you know.


Jessica St. Clair  53:29

Yeah, and not a titan of industry. You know, and that’s what I love about it, like when.


June Diane Raphael  53:36

I kept on asking what’s the main industry here? And I think I got like a lot of remote workers. I was like, okay.


Jessica St. Clair  53:43

I don’t know what is up down there. But I like the vibe, I learned.


June Diane Raphael  53:48

A lot of money and like La Jolla and like those, but I went to this dog beach and apparently people move there for this dog beach so.


Jessica St. Clair  53:58

Yes, I can imagine it.


June Diane Raphael  54:01

Oh, Jess.


Jessica St. Clair  54:02

There anything better than dogs, Galavan.


June Diane Raphael  54:06

And it’s so big that they were really just they’re all off leash and they’re all living, they’re living, and to honestly polar bears that arrived to white polar bears, and to see them running about with like little yips and yaps and then different all these breeds together.


Jessica St. Clair  54:31

I was if you are depressed, now it’s so the two times I’ve had like, you know, been fired. I’ve been like, I’ve woken up and said, take me to the dog beach and Dan has dragged my lifeless body to Seal Beach where there is one it’s an hour away, you have to drive that long.


June Diane Raphael  54:50

I know, should I go though it sounds it’s a long drive.


Jessica St. Clair  54:53

It is fun, but I gotta tell you if you really low and you know what you’ve already got spray tan, you’ve tried the you’ve tried the regular stuff. Seal Beach is another place where people aren’t trying that hard. They’re covered in ink. Everybody is tattooed within the inch of their lives. They all look like Jesse James. So you don’t have to feel like you come as you are it Seal Beach is what I’ll say. And but if you are down and maybe we’ll do a little bit of a field trip there because it’ll show me the person who cannot be happy watching dogs go nuts on a beach.


June Diane Raphael  55:30

There ain’t one.


Jessica St. Clair  55:32

Yeah, and I didn’t know these things even existed. I didn’t know there were dog beaches. So bond [..] type of feeling and everyone also there is like loving each other’s dogs. It’s okay that your dog comes out over and like jumps on someone’s picnic blanket. Like it’s cute, it’s fun, and it’s fun and it’s their time. And we are so happy to honestly have been invited like that was the feeling like I’m just happy that they’re okay with me here.


June Diane Raphael  56:01

Because the fun that they’re having is outrageous, it’s just they’re running through the water. There, it was so much fun and then yeah, occasionally it’s like oh, that’s his ball. Okay, yeah, here let me get that ball back to you drop that unit Sure but boy oh boy. My one of my favorite things in the world, I’m so sorry this is such an animal podcast.


Jessica St. Clair  56:30

It is what it is.


June Diane Raphael  56:32

One of my favorite thing is a must love dogs, must love dogs are one of my favorite things. You see a dog because it’s like sometimes Bingos like picking up socks and stuff off the floor.


June Diane Raphael  56:44

And what the fuck does he know the difference between a sock and and a toy? Like he doesn’t. But to see him when where he gets a sock or something, and then we’re like, drop it, drop it, to see the way he then prances around with it is joyful. God it makes me.


Jessica St. Clair  56:44



Jessica St. Clair  57:02

It’s joyful, one time […] one time in New Hampshire where I Bibi and I had overstayed our welcome at my parents house, and of course, Cookie was a puppy and was terrorizing Thomas R. Two.


June Diane Raphael  57:18

Yeah, how that go?


Jessica St. Clair  57:19

It didn’t go well. Not well at all. It almost broke my family apart, and that’s no joke. It did create a rift that we’re still healing from, I’m serious. It was not good. It was mistakes were made members.


June Diane Raphael  57:32

I do remember getting a text that like Cookie was not being welcomed in the way that you had hoped.


Jessica St. Clair  57:40

I thought I thought bringing a puppy that’s not house trained to your parents, your elderly parents home would be a welcome surprise. It wasn’t. But one time Cookie peeled a dehydrated smash Toad carcass off the blacktop of the driveway. She peeled it off and ran into the house. And then all I can tell you is I chased her because I was like, oh my God, you know, my mother’s Martha Stewart’s house. And I chased her and I could hear the Benny Hill Music […] And as because he was racing around the house because he thought his game, pieces of dehydrated Toad are flinging off into the home. It was a nightmare. It was a nightmare.


June Diane Raphael  58:37

Oh my god, that’s so funny.


Jessica St. Clair  58:39

But also the funniest thing I’ve ever seen. But it was like If my mother comes in and sees this, these, this Toad carcass, you know, flinging into the air, we’re going to be in a lot of trouble.


June Diane Raphael  58:51

Well, I at one point when I was working at this restaurant waitressing in in my 20s. The bartender very nice guy was going away, he was musician and he was like, oh, I’m going away for a couple weeks, like do you have any desire to stay at my apartment? Now I was in I think it was still at my parents house. And he had an apartment in Brooklyn, like right in Bloomsburg, right off the train. I was like, yeah, of course. He was such a lovely guy so he, I get there. And he’s like, oh, yeah, I have a cat. And I’m like, and he’s like, but but she’s mostly an outdoor cat. And I was like, okay, I ran out got my Benadryl because I’ve already committed he’s now gone to tour. So you’re gonna do but I’ll never forget I had a suitcase that I was living out of. And one day I came home and he always told me like, leave the window open so caca glass and come back in. And one day I come back and I go into my suitcase, like change into my night clothes. And there’s a fucking bird in there […]


Jessica St. Clair  1:00:01

They do hate you. That’s like what the mafia does.


June Diane Raphael  1:00:05

Like, I was told, because I was like, I gotta get out of here. Like, I can’t ever go into the suitcase again, like, I was so fucking upset.


Jessica St. Clair  1:00:13

They bring it as a prize to you.


June Diane Raphael  1:00:14

That’s what I heard. I told everybody I was like, this cat wants to kill me. And they’re like, no, actually, that was a sign of love.


Jessica St. Clair  1:00:23

Like that, but that’s where you’re okay. And then I know, we’ve talked for an hour about dogs and cats. With that’s where you’re, I understand the disconnect, because you’re like this, and I don’t springing this dead carcass as a present. And that’s not something you want. That’s like when you have two different love languages. And it’s just hard to make it work.


June Diane Raphael  1:00:49

It’s so true, because I did it. You’re exactly right, that it was like a mafia hit. I was like I’ve been marked, you know. Like, they’re all going to come from me. And I couldn’t go back into my suitcase. Like it was so terrible. I just zip it up and throw everything out.


Jessica St. Clair  1:01:07

I hate to bring them up, but I tell you what Jason Mantzoukas did to me once.


June Diane Raphael  1:01:11



Jessica St. Clair  1:01:12

We were house sitting, you know, I can’t believe in our 20s we like survived this type of Vagabond existence. But really, I don’t even know whose house was it. But we had to come out to LA with me money. And so the two of us were house sitting for some house God I don’t even know where it was, was this beautiful modern house. And on the way out, I had, we were in JetBlue eating our snacks and I started to watch a lifetime show was a reenactment of a crime. Who was very gruesome where was the women would be abducted from a fast food drive thru window right up my alley, okay. And then they would get you know, taped up and then the in the reenactment that killer would then whisper, man, I take your order into there. So I started to watch it, and Jason said, like, they took some creative liberties without reenact probably, but I’ll never forget, like, it’s still burning. And so I was starting to watch it. And Jason said, just so you know, I don’t think you can handle something like this. And I said, please don’t tell me what to do. I’m not in your conservative ship like, please stop mansplaining go watch your own thing. I’m gonna watch this. I can handle this and don’t tell me what to do. And so what he did was the night we got there to LA again, foreign land, trying to launch a career very nervous, far from home. He waited until I fell asleep. He kept himself up.


June Diane Raphael  1:02:50

Oh, wait a second.


Jessica St. Clair  1:02:51

He crept in to the room and whispered may I take your order? In my face? Sick?


June Diane Raphael  1:03:05

How fucking sick is sick stuff? Sick and fucked up.


Jessica St. Clair  1:03:11

Yeah, that’s the kind of Terror i was living with.


June Diane Raphael  1:03:14

I’m so sorry, I’m so sorry. Yeah, it’s like I was dealing with like dead cats in my suitcases but I was alone like to have to be in that somebody was like […] Yeah, that’s a whole other that’s a whole other people […]


Jessica St. Clair  1:03:29

Like does Zouk’s Cubes and Zouk’s Cubes and this and that. And like they don’t know what the real thing to travel with him, okay?


June Diane Raphael  1:03:40

Yeah, anyway, guys. Last thing, I promise and then we’re gonna wrap it up. One thing that I really love, so you know, Justin down the block, my friend he, his his dog has been like playing wonderfully with our dogs, with Van Gogh and so he texted I said, hey, does Sisi want to play date? You know, and does he want to have a playdate with Bingo? And he wrote back I don’t know why when we we laughed so hard because not the first time he’s written this back. When I’ve asked and he’ll he’ll write back she would love to. Just like she would love to like Jess, and I know we shouldn’t anthropomorphize and all that stuff, it just really makes me laugh.


Jessica St. Clair  1:04:28

I love it.


June Diane Raphael  1:04:28

I would love too. I just love it so much.


June Diane Raphael  1:04:32

It’s fun, this is fun.


June Diane Raphael  1:04:36

I don’t know God. Where the fuck is this podcast going? Just one more exchange on text that made me laugh so hard, Jack McBrayer, if you you know, the comedian Jack McBrayer from 30 Rock and he remembers everybody’s birthdays and texts you on your birthday, which is the sweetest thing ever. You will not have seen him in years and he’ll text you but he texted me randomly and said hey sweetie, I was just thinking about you how you do and I I think the last time I saw you was a year ago and I said, yes, I go and surprisingly, I look younger now. And I said, do you think I have Benjamin Button syndrome? And he wrote no, you’ve got Benjamin butthole syndrome.


Jessica St. Clair  1:05:28



June Diane Raphael  1:05:29

Oh, thrilled me. And that was it. I will hear from him again for another year.


Jessica St. Clair  1:05:36

That’ll tide you over though.


June Diane Raphael  1:05:38

You’ve Benjamim buttholes.


Jessica St. Clair  1:05:40

Too mean, I love it.


June Diane Raphael  1:05:42

We’ll Jess, you know, yet again, I came in today, and I felt sad. And I was like, I don’t really know what I got to offer. I’m not doing this podcast the right time. It’s too early. And I’m walking out feeling lighter. And how to thank you.


Jessica St. Clair  1:05:58

Me too, me too. And thank you for indulging us some of these podcasts, some of these episodes are going to be for Mommy, you know, they’re not going to be for anyone else. And that’s, you know.


June Diane Raphael  1:06:06

For our listener, new listeners stay with us.


Jessica St. Clair  1:06:12

Yeah, stay with us.


June Diane Raphael  1:06:15

This is exactly what you should expect, I don’t know.


Jessica St. Clair  1:06:20

Yes, and please join the Academy if you’d like we’re going to I actually did think I’d love to do homework assignment about people’s pets I’d love or at least a happy hour where people who lose their pets. A yappy hour.


June Diane Raphael  1:06:33



Jessica St. Clair  1:06:38

I stole that from the gym club. We do yappy hours there, but like yes, yes, we do the Yappy Hour.


June Diane Raphael  1:06:45

Come join us, we’re doing some really weird things.


Jessica St. Clair  1:06:48

Really weird assignment.


June Diane Raphael  1:06:49

Who knows? I actually wanted to talk to you about this, Jess but I would love to do start doing a you know, our episodes come out on Wednesday, start doing a recap show alive.


Jessica St. Clair  1:07:03



June Diane Raphael  1:07:04

Where we can just kind of, yeah, we can just kind of talk about like, I mean, I don’t know that there’s any more to say.


Jessica St. Clair  1:07:12

Watch What Happens Live, watch What Happens Live where […] we’re also going, you know, listen, I love the DMs I get from everybody about their responses because you know, they really do feel that that this is a two way podcast. It they’ve got suggestions for us if we’re struggling with something pill boxes, I have so many so many I still get you know, for you about how to remember your Wellbutrin, you know, they’re thinking about us.


June Diane Raphael  1:07:39

Yeah, so appreciate that.


Jessica St. Clair  1:07:41

We need it that’s like we need it. And I just wanted to wait.


June Diane Raphael  1:07:45

Because this is the type of stuff we need to address in the after show but I just want to say that I did get myself together in terms of my poll taking.


Jessica St. Clair  1:07:53

I had something that was just what a lot of people were suggesting, which was like morning afternoon I had that I just couldn’t find it for very long. So I did find it and on the right dose of well, you tried that pin […] bounce yeah. That’s the chicken or the egg.


June Diane Raphael  1:08:12

Yeah, exactly, you know. While Jess, I’ve never stopped thinking about the fact that cats haven’t evolved in yet we’ve evolved around them I’ll never stop thinking about that as long as I live I’ll never stop questioning their you know, dictatorship oppressive regime that we all.


Jessica St. Clair  1:08:31

You know why they meow? Do you want to know why they meow? I’m gonna leave you with this chilling fact. They don’t meow to each other. It is not a thing that cats do to anyone else than humans. And that is because they have learned to mimic a baby’s cry. We’ll be back next week.


CREDITS 1:09:45

The DEEP DIVE is produced by Lemonada media Jessica St. Clair and June Diane Raphael. Our producers Ana Cecilia, our associate producer is Dani Matias and ours supervising producer is Jamela Zarha Williams. Our engineer is Johnny Vince Evans. Additional Lemonada support from Steve Nelson, Stephanie Wittels Wachs and Jessica Cordova Kramer. Special thanks to Anne Geddes for a cover art and Lennon Parham for her sweet, sweet vocals. The best way to support us is to rate and review. Follow The Deep Dive wherever you get your podcasts or listen ad free on Amazon music with your Prime membership.

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