As Angela and Margherita Missoni

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Fashion mother and daughter duo, Angela and Margherita Missoni, join Sinéad in Milan to talk about their experience leading a family business, making the fashion industry more environmentally conscious, and how motherhood changed them.


[00:07] Sinéad Burke: Happy New Year! Welcome to 2020 and a whole new episode of As Me with Sinéad, in case you’ve forgotten over the holidays, I’m Sinéad. And what’s on my mind this week is actually beautiful words from a note that we received from Gesu about the impact that the podcast is having on people. It’s so lovely. My Irishness is almost preventing me reading this to you, but he wrote, “the episodes are not only beautiful, but real. It’s what this broken world needs. To know we’re all a little bit broken, but it doesn’t make us less perfect. Hell, it’s actually what makes us diamonds. Those cuts give us our hard exteriors.” Thank you. And what a privilege to be able to facilitate conversations and to give people the space to demonstrate that we’re all a little bit broken and, well, we’re diamonds. This leads me perfectly to this week’s episode, during which I sat down with the mother and daughter duo behind the Missoni fashion house to talk about what motivates them, and how they describe not only themselves, but each other. 


[01:21] Margherita Missoni: I definitely felt like I had to grow out of the Missoni family name. You feel entangled as a branch of a tree, you know. It’s like a big knot of, like, fashion, Missoni, the family, the place where we grew up, we all have a very deep sense of belonging, deep roots in this place. 


[01:42] Sinéad Burke: It’s the first time we’ve had a duo of guests sitting in front of us on As Me and, well, it’s a conversation that you really, really do not want to miss. Are you ready? Let’s go!


[02:00] Sinéad Burke: We are in a studio in Milan and sitting either side of me — I’m nestled between two extraordinary women. And this is the first time on the show that we will be in conversation with two people. There’ll be three voices. But these two women are incredible for so many reasons. They have forged a pathway in a very patriarchal domain. And they have changed fashion as we know it. I’m nestled between Angela and Margherita Missoni — incredible women who I am so thrilled that you said yes when this came about. Thank you so much for being here.


[02:35] Angela Missoni: Thank you. 


[02:36] Margherita Missoni: Yes, it’s a pleasure. [02:37][2.6]


[02:38] Sinéad Burke: The first question I would love to ask is, how do you describe yourselves personally and professionally? You go first, Angela.


[02:46] Angela Missoni: I go first. How do I describe myself? Very simply, as a woman, as a mother, as a daughter, as a grandma and as a designer. But more of than a designer today, even as a manager. 


[03:09] Sinéad Burke: What about you, Margherita? 


[03:12] Margherita Missoni: I also think of myself as a professionally an in-between creative and managerial type of vision. I wouldn’t have been — I couldn’t have been a pure artist. I’m really interested in all the dynamics of marketing and merchandising and products. So it’s hard to categorize, right, always and to put yourself especially into categories. So I think I’m in between. Personally, I’m a mother, I’m a wife, I’m a daughter, I’m a granddaughter. But I think a few years ago when I left Missoni for the first time, I left because I chose to put my life quality as my main priority in life. And I’m still carrying that on. So I’ve accepted this role when I understood that it would make my life better and not worse. So I would say that private life is still a priority number one. 


[04:20] Sinéad Burke: How do you describe your mom? 


[04:22] Margherita Missoni: She’s very motherly in general. So she naturally tends to take charge and also to take care both in her private life and in her professional life. Yeah. 


[04:40] Sinéad Burke: What do you think of Margherita? 


[04:42] Angela Missoni: Margherita has a name, which is the name of a flower in Italian. And she is in full bloom and she’s full of ideas. She’s always been very, very creative. She was a very, very good writer. I always — I’m always sorry that she didn’t keep that on one side. One day it’s gonna be good for you. But she is very talented. And she has eyes, also for me — when they ask me which are my qualities and I don’t know, but for sure I got eyes. I can see this is and you see detail. And she sees and she understand this business. I am more like I do love to fix the clothes. I do to make the clothes also. But she has more the sense of the stage. She’s always. She’s like my mother, I always say. The two of them will always get out of the house very precisely. They take care of their looks from the shoe, from head to toes, and every detail for every event. I’m a bit more of a hippie. 


[05:53] Margherita Missoni: Even Sunday brunch, 


[05:55] Angela Missoni: Even Sunday brunch, Margherita will be —


[05:59] Margherita Missoni: And we travel on one hand like it’s me and my grandmother — 


[06:02] Sinéad Burke: How do you travel? How many bags? 


[06:05] Angela Missoni: But that’s another story that goes on in the family, also with daughter Theresa, because Margherita has this pride. She travel with a carry on. And then also Theresa and me, we have another kind of body. We have another volume. Right. So yes, of course, she put little two little shorts and two these shirts and she’s okay. No, we have to carry more stuff. 


[06:34] Sinéad Burke: I should be like you, Margherita, and carry small things, but I’m very much like you. I have no excuse. 


[06:40] Margherita Missoni: You’re making a point for me. 


[06:41] Sinéad Burke: If I was in Missoni, I would be like you and Theresa. But what was it like growing up first for you, Angela. I grew up knowing of Missoni as this establishment, an institution. But what intrigues me most is you were both born into this family. Did you know what it was? 


[06:59] Angela Missoni: No. And then actually very different from me than Margherita or my kid, because I grew while the company was growing and my parents founded — they started this business in 1953 when they married. I was born 1958. So when they had their first show in 1965, I was there. I was there. And I remember every single little detail of all the shows that I’ve seen, of all the people that I’ve met. Of all the world that forced the fashion world, which was this very small world at the time. But I think there are no people of my age that have seen a show in Palazzo Pitti Firenze. But I was there because just my parents would take me around, like not to leave me home alone. So I grew and I grew with the name also, which is a different thing. I was not Angela Missoni. 


[08:00] Sinéad Burke: You were just Angela. 


[08:01] Angela Missoni: I was Angela. Yes. And I know I was always very curious. And this is what made my fortune in my job, because I never go to the archives. I remember every single detail. I ask things from the archives. 


[08:18] Sinéad Burke: On that first show, you were still school age? 


[08:22] Oh, no. School age? I was 9, 7 years old. 


[08:27] Sinéad Burke: What was the conversation that happened in your classroom? Your parents were putting on this enormous fashion show in this time.


[08:36] Angela Missoni: Don’t think that the big shows, there were big shows. It was handled in a theater which is called the Teatro Gerolamo a Milano, which is — which I thought when I enter, I thought it was La Scala. And later on when enter La Scala, I said, I’ve been here. No, it’s a tiny, tiny, theater. And maybe it has 90 places. The fashion industry was not the fashion industry that today, so there were journalists from Milan. 


[09:10] Margherita Missoni: You have to consider that like in books, pret a porte was started in 1958. So it really was a much smaller deal. 


[09:19] Sinéad Burke: When did you first become aware of the enormity and the importance of that? 


[09:25] Angela Missoni: Oh. Later on when my kids were born with a name.


[09:33] Margherita Missoni: We were not born with. You gave us the name.


[09:35] Angela Missoni: No, no, no, no. They were anyway. They were my children that were recognized of being my children. They had two names. Right. But they had the father’s name and my name. But anyway, they were recognized being my children. 


[09:49] Angela Missoni: I remember the day — one day it hit me that it was a special thing, you know, that their job was people were looking up to them, and they were famous, you know. 


[10:02] Sinéad Burke: What was that day? 


[10:03] Margherita Missoni: I was in the car driving in the back seat and I was entering my grandma’s house, which was right next to the company, the factory — because we have a factory which is quite rare in fashion nowadays. I was like, wow, they’re famous. It’s like a big deal, you know. Of course, I had a very special upbringing where, because we lived right next to the factory and they worked a lot, my mom and my grandma, we hung out a lot there. And Fashion Factory offers a lot of fun children activities from colors, to papers, to clothes, scissors and pieces of fabric. And to me, that was just normal. You know, it wasn’t something special. And I remember when it hit me that it’s like special. And, you know, the people we’d meet, you know, all that was my school and what influenced me. But you had Anna Piaggi was like gifting me vintage children clothes from the ‘60s when I was six or seven. That was normality, which, it’s not that it was fancy in a way or like a jet-set necessarily, but it definitely was a lot of creative stimulation. 


[11:20] Sinéad Burke: Did you ever feel like you had to grow into the Missoni name?


[11:24] Margherita Missoni: I definitely felt like I had to grow out of the Missoni family name. Growing up like that, it’s quite — you feel it entangled as a branch of a tree, you know, it’s like a big knot of like fashion, Missoni, the family, the place where we grew up. We all have a very deep sense of belonging in this place, which is great and it’s what also saved me later on in life during my New York years, you know, having a lot to lose at home. But at the time when I was finished high school at 18, the only thing I wanted was like going into a city. We like city lights and life and also to be away I guess from that, and to understand who I was an individual. So I studied philosophy and then acting, which was very therapeutic. But looking back, it was all need of introspection and figuring out that I could exist on my own. And I could only come back and started working with my mom when I was pretty comfortable. 


[12:34] Sinéad Burke: And what did you learn about yourself? 


[12:35] Margherita Missoni: You know, I never had expectations from her. She was always the Montessori kind of mom. Freedom was an essential value, and it’s what she gave me. But I had the pressure from my grandmother, although didn’t mean it. I was the eldest and I was a very good kid. She could take me on trips with her, you know, just to Paris to go to flea markets because I would never complain, never ask.


[13:03] Angela Missoni: She was the best kid. But she would study the sports newspaper of the day to be prepare to keep the conversation with her grandma and her grandpa. 


[13:19] Margherita Missoni: I wanted to be the best, in general and in their eyes. And she says — and one day she was talking — “No, it’s not that I want you to be the best. It’s just that if you’re the best, you’re happy. So she wants happiness. This whole process is what I had to understand that I could —


[13:38] Angela Missoni: Very strange because this didn’t happen with us kids. We were brought up. She was busier, she was probably busier. And I never felt the pressure — none of us felt the pressure. Brothers felt the pressure of coming into work in the factory. Instead, I had my father, who would usually say, no, no, you go and do something else so we can close the factory. I can go and actually close. He would say, I would put the bomb on this factory. My father didn’t wanted to have responsibility, right? In his character He needed to be free. Totally. 


[14:16] Sinéad Burke: And when did you decide that this is what you wanted to do? Did you ever want to do anything else? 


[14:22] Angela Missoni: Yes, I wanted to — I was not a good student, but I would have loved to study psychology. Maybe for the need of introspection. I have maybe wanted to be a veterinarian, but I had — I wanted to become a mother. This for me, I was 15, and I was saying — at the time she was age 15 and she was saying, I’m going to study in New York or London away. I was saying myself, I’m going to — at 18, I’m going to have children. My mom almost fainted. 


[14:53] Margherita Missoni: She got pregnant at 23. 


[14:54] Angela Missoni: Yeah, by 28, I had my three kids. So I was working in the company, but just to get pocket money. I was doing this sales, I was assisting my mom, but never with a big passion. I only was driven for maternity. And then every child I had, I took really time to be home with my kids. And I remember when Margherita was maybe seven or eight month, one day my mom said, “by the way, when do you think to come back to work?” And then I said, “Mom, I always hear you saying that the only regret that you have is that you didn’t have enough time for us. So I think I’m gonna stay home a little bit more.” Then she didn’t say anything, of course. And then in between my kids, I wanted to do other things. I opened a kindergarden, a kinder playground when she was born. I started to do a project of an organic chicken farm when I was pregnant of my son Francesco. And then when I was pregnant of Theresa, I had a kind of — I said no, no, no, because I was working in and out, right? Then I said, no, no, no, no. I went to my dad. I remember I said, I’m not going to work in this factory anymore. This is not my job. I’m going to be — and he said, “what would you like to do?” And I said, “I would like to design children’s clothes.” This is like, of course, everything. And then I said I design jewelry. And then he said, you know, if you have any project, think about this company like an umbrella, and you can develop your project under this umbrella. There’s no need for you to work with your mom every single day. Blink. No, no, no, it is not personal. He understood that I needed to take my own independence. 


[16:48] Sinéad Burke: It’s your story!


[16:49] Margherita Missoni: Exactly. You respond and you act towards your mom, or your kid, or your — even if it’s not a kid, adult children. Very different way that you would react to other people that work with you. That is sometimes challenging and difficult to deal with. 


[17:05] Sinéad Burke: It’s this ability to have such a strong support network. But also your patience is often quite less with those you love the most. 


[17:13] Margherita Missoni: Exactly. So it’s good when you’re when you can structure that you trust each other, you know, like I think taste-wise and style-wise we really trust each other. We know we share an aesthetic. But on the other hand, you know, give the responsibility separately. 


[17:33] Angela Missoni: Yeah, but then what was very curious was that — OK, so, I started to do project. Then I started to follow licensing from Missoni and then I realized I knew the job. I knew the label. I could do that. But in fact, I said yes, but I would like to work fashion, to do fashion. And I ask if the family agreed that I was doing my own project, the Angela Missoni line, and with started to be solids. And I could see that my mom was very impressed by the way that I was handling everything from beginning to the end, to the show, to the make-up. Whatever. I was following the full — I’d done it forever. And then after two, three seasons, I started adding little pattern here, a little pattern there. And I after the fourth show, my mom came and she said that she loved the show. And she said, “have you ever thought of doing the main line?” And I said no, because that was her job. And she said, “I think you should, because what you are doing is what I would like Missoni to be today. I have many things they want to do.” And basically, she gave me her job. She left her job in my hands. It took me like three, four season. I started to do the editing for the show, the collection. I started taking care of the advertising. And then after three, four season, I was out on the catwalk on my own. And then my dad was always taking care of the pattern. And my dad said to me, I am at your service. You know what I’m good at? You just ask what you need.


[19:09] Sinéad Burke: But I think it’s amazing in many ways because nothing means more to me than sincere praise from my parents. They are so supportive, but they are probably two of the few people in the world who will tell me what they really think. And I think that idea of — how did you feel in that moment when your mother said to you, this is what the future of this family and this company —


[19:31] Angela Missoni: When I took charge at the end, I would say — because people were saying to me that I had a lot of courage. And I always have a discussion about courage, what courage means, when you don’t know exactly where you’re going. Is it a choice or are you just unconscious and you go? But then I — in fact, as Margherita said, I take responsibility, I take charge. I take responsibility. 


[20:03] Sinéad Burke: And do you think that’s because your vision was to be a mother so early on that you already had many of those skills?


[20:13] Angela Missoni: I don’t know. I think that the fact of being a mother very young opened me up to the world. I was introverted as a character. And since that, I think that that flow of love that you can retain at the end it goes all around. 


[20:34] Sinéad Burke: More after the break. 


[21:42] Sinéad Burke: You have both led this incredible pathway, as you said, fashion began in many ways at the doorstep of Missoni. And you have traveled through so many different times and spaces with fashion. What have been the big changes that you have experienced? 


[22:01] Angela Missoni: My mom, she was showing something very shear in Lurex and all of the sudden she realized that the underwear of the girl was still very heavy, white. And then she said to the girl, take it off. 


[22:17] Margherita Missoni: The bra.


[22:21] Angela Missoni: Take off the bra! And then it was a huge scandal. And then they said [speaking Italian] 


[22:31] Margherita Missoni: Crazy whores. 


[22:33] Sinéad Burke: Wow. 


[22:34] Angela Missoni: But then, two months later, St. Laurent presented the new look. 


[22:42] Sinéad Burke: Hmm. 


[22:40] Angela Missoni: No, no, no, no. It’s true. It was a moment. Right. So, so and so that’s the story. And in Sumirago, when they did the first show — let’s say the first Milan show — it’s like if they open Milan Fashion Week. The crowd — I don’t know, there were maybe 90 people? And in that crowd, you had all the top boutique, the American store, all the president, and the press that counted. Can you believe that? Today with a thousand.


[23:20] Sinéad Burke: At least! What have been the changes that you’ve experienced since you’ve been part and now at the helm?


[23:32] Margherita Missoni: Definitely it was not as viral and present as it is today. It was much more niche. It was much more — well, the shows were already big when I was young. It was less personal. Everybody showed at the fiera, almost everyone in those years. So you just changed rooms and a different designer was there. But it was for people who worked in fashion. It was not broad. Now it’s broad. And it’s through social media. And through — everyone has a little piece of fashion bits in them, in their life, not only clothes, but images and an opinion about it. But what I realized that’s really changed while looking back at the archives for my new project is really how fashion was fun and light at the beginning of the pret a porter. The shows there were doing, it was like, why not? You know? So a show on inflatables in a swimming pool. A show where the Fontana studio cut the models to come out. And this is what I really realized that it’s lacking. There’s a lot of pretentiousness today when there is no need for it and doesn’t add anything to the brand. So that’s really what I would like to try to go back to. 


[25:04] Sinéad Burke: I was at your show during Milan Fashion Week — I think it’s my third, if not my fourth Missoni show. And one of the things that I’m always really moved by is the genuine and sincere and tangible love that that audience has not only for Missoni the brand, but Missoni the family. I was sitting around some incredibly important and influential editors and everybody said, you know, there is just such a connection to you both as people, to your mom and to your whole family. Why, after 60 years, over 60 years, do you think that there is still such a love for Missoni? Why do you think it still matters to people?


[25:50] Margherita Missoni: I think when you have something, when you communicate something that is actually real, people really perceive that. And that’s when something is successful from a communication point of view. And we’ve been the center as well as a family of our communication. But it’s true, that’s a fact. And I think that’s part of the sympathy. And we’ve been independent for a long time. And we’ve worked outside the city. And I think that also puts us a bit — being in the countryside — put us a bit on the side of the fashion feuds. We’ve never had any enemies or we’re friends with all the other designers.


[26:32] Angela Missoni: My parents were the first generation. They were very well respected. 


[26:35] Margherita Missoni: Yeah, but still. There were, like, already —


[26:39] Angela Missoni: But first-generation. There was there was my parents. Mariuccia Mandelli. This was the point. Everybody else came later. 


[26:50] Margherita Missoni: There’s a new TV show since last night in Italy about the beginning of pret a porter. And there were feuds already.  


[27:01] Sinéad Burke: And I think some of the reason why people have such a love for the brand is because there’s a personal connection. We feel like we know you. We feel like we know your family. But is that ever a challenge? 


[27:16] Margherita Missoni: No. 


[27:17] Angela Missoni: You know how you read comments saying “I want to be adopted by the Missonis.” 


[27:24] Sinéad Burke: Well, if you’re submitting and taking applications, I’ll apply. I can give you the form before you leave.


[27:31] Margherita Missoni: I think that, you know, you’re never obliged to give out everything. And that’s the way it is. And it’s easy to portray because it’s real. But on the other hand, it’s not intrusive. 


[27:44] Angela Missoni: No. And then plus there is a real respect for what my parents invented. They invented a style which is very rare in fashion. 


[27:57] Sinéad Burke: And still so unique. 


[27:58] Angela Missoni: Yeah. And also that you find families that they treasured them, Missoni, for generations, they treasure. So they arrive at the fourth generation thing. I’m wearing the clothes of my great-great — they keep them. Like it’s a link, right? It became a link. Because really it was an invention in style. 


[28:17] Sinéad Burke: It’s incredible. On your hardest days, be it in work or be at you as people, as Angela and as Margherita. What do you tell yourselves to try to feel better and to try to be courageous, or brave, or confident? What do you stand in front of the mirror and say to yourself?


[28:39] Angela Missoni: In my worst moments in life, any way which included when my brother died, when my father died, that I had the moment where I think I could take care of others, taking care of the others it’s what I have to keep — I have to be up to take care of the others. My nephews or it was about my mother. It was about taking care of my dad. It was the fact that I was acting — I need the action to overcome things. Yeah. 


[29:18] Margherita Missoni: I always feel really lucky that in my upbringing I was never pushed in a direction or the other and I was let through live my moments. And now, looking back, I’m really able to read and see how the different moments brought me to where I am now. So I always keep that in mind. And think really that everything that’s happening is going to bring me somewhere else and has a purpose. So that really allows me to look at things with a distance. And in the bigger scheme of things, when work is tough, I always think I can not think of doing this for all my life, but not this specifically, anything. You know, it terrifies me. So I always give myself like ten years. 


[30:06] Angela Missoni: I’m laughing because that’s what I said when I started at Missoni. 


[30:11] Margherita Missoni: Yeah, but you didn’t — I’m different. 


[30:14] Angela Missoni: No, no, you’re different from me for sure. I had to stay. Nobody else was. What if not? 


[30:23] Margherita Missoni: In 10 years, you know, another chapter of my life will be gone and I’ll be doing something totally different.


[30:30] Sinéad Burke: We’ll be back just after this break. 


[31:39] Sinéad Burke: We started this conversation talking about the packing of suitcases, and the different types of luggage that we travel with. And it was interesting, Angela, that you mentioned your body. What’s it like to live in your body? 


[32:00] Angela Missoni: I live well in my body, even though I’m not anymore size — a model’s size, let’s say.


[32:07] Margherita Missoni: We’ve never been model’s size. 


[32:11] Angela Missoni: No, but in the ‘70s and ‘80s, models were size — 


[32:15] Margherita Missoni: No, but I would say, too, you know, growing up, I mean, if you’re like, you know, if you think of yourself as pretty or good. Yeah, that’s not easy growing up next to Giselle. You know what I mean? When you’re 15 and going through your teenage — 


[32:30] Angela Missoni: But then the good thing is that when you live close to Giselle, you know, because that’s what you learn that she’s worried about a pimple, she was worried — they always, even the most amazing women or men that we admire, everything — they look at the mirror, they find something wrong with themselves, right. 


[32:58] Margherita Missoni: They leave room, growing up and moving on, especially in a word like this, where it’s full of like incredibly beautiful, gorgeous people that everybody looks up to. It’s like what really makes a difference in the charm and attraction of a person is the confidence. And that’s given to you when during your upbringing, your roots, the love you feel around you.


[33:21] Sinéad Burke: And what’s it like to live in your body now, Margherita, because you talked about that relationship changing.


[33:26] Margherita Missoni: I feel really lucky because I’ve always felt I felt quite confident about myself. Not as in I’m the most beautiful person in the world, but as in confident with being different. 


[33:41] Angela Missoni: She was always being naked at home. I had to tell her, Margherita — 


[33:45] Margherita Missoni: At one point she had to tell me, no, you’re twelve. And that’s it. 


[33:48] Angela Missoni: Close the door to your room sometimes! Like you cannot be naked — 


[33:55] Margherita Missoni: I was in the kitchen. I’m very — I’m not self-conscious at all. 


[34:03] Sinéad Burke: Was that something you inherited or was it just you?


[34:06] It was for sure the way I was brought up, it was like a bit like that. But I’m definitely more than my siblings, or any anyone else in my family.


[34:17] Sinéad Burke: I’m the oldest, too, and I think I share that with you, that freedom to be myself. I had nothing to compare myself to. I was it. I was the one who led the way my siblings. 


[34:27] Margherita Missoni: No, but that for me was the freedom when I was — we were talking before about the expectations of my grandmother — my big break was like letting go of the free — that and becoming free of like making mistakes, and really being myself, with my vanities that maybe I wouldn’t allow before, or, you know, interest in small, superficial things sometimes. 


[34:51] Sinéad Burke: I love that freedom from a fashion company is getting naked at 12 in the kitchen. What do you both want your legacy to be?


[35:02] Angela Missoni: To live the values of the family, and to live the value of the company, for sure. To the next generation. That’s what I work for through those years, in the past years. I want it  because I knew that the third generation wanted — really had a passion and an affection for this company, which is more than a company. It’s what links the family. And I wanted to leave them this company for them to enjoy, to work there, or to be — but in good health. So that’s what I’ve done to try to fix. I’m a fixer. I’m a fixer. I try always to fix things and make them better in my way, for what I think it’s better, of course. I knew that I was the generation in between, in the middle, and I had this duty to leave them something in good health, to the third and maybe a generation to come. 


[35:59] Margherita Missoni: I would like my kids to feel totally free. You know, it’s always difficult, the balance. When you have something like that, it’s great, but then you’re never totally free of doing — no, I’m doing my job. My work. And because I enjoy it, and not because of a legacy that I want to leave in the future I think from the professional side. It’s a passion. And I like to live my life like that. The only legacy I’d like to leave is on the private front in my family. You know, I’d love, I’m hoping for my children to grow up as independent adults. So they have a passion and something that drives them and gives them good reasons to be here.


[36:48] Sinéad Burke: It has been such a joy and a wonder to speak with you both and to learn from you. I cannot thank you enough. I am going to leave this room enjoying my own physical body, and being naked in the kitchen, not in my family home, I promise. But actually balancing both creativity and freedom in lots of different ways. Thank you so much.


[37:09] Angela Missoni: Thank you. 


[37:08] Margherita Missoni: Thank you. It was a pleasure. 


[37:17] Sinéad Burke: Over the holidays, I’ve been thinking a lot about legacy, and the impact that we have on the world and each other. One of the people who I admire most passed away at the end of last year. And as you prepare for the final gathering to celebrate all that you achieved and the people that she impacted — the extraordinary Mama Cax — it’s really left me thinking, what can we do every day to make those around us, ourselves and the world a little bit better? And a place that we want to exist and be ourselves and feel free to do so a little bit more. Also, in January, I started a newsletter. Yes, I have a newsletter and podcasts like everybody else on your timeline. But if you would like to subscribe, just go to 


[38:06] Sinéad Burke: This week’s Person You Should Know is making history. Mariya Russell. She is a Michelin star chef who is the chef de cuisine at the Chicago restaurant Kumiko and Kikko. She was awarded the Michelen star in October 2019 and became the first black woman to ever receive this honor. Mariya is over on Instagram. If you want to follow her and drool at everything that she’s creating and be inspired by all that she is, it’s @mariyaleniserussell. Thanks so much for joining us on this week’s episode. And as always, let us know what you think. See you again next week.


[38:49] As Me with Sinéad is a Lemonada Media original and is executive produced by Jessica Cordova Kramer. Assistant produced by Claire Jones and edited by Ivan Kuraev. Music is by Jerome Rankin. Our sales and distribution partner is Westwood One. If you’ve liked what you’ve heard, don’t be shy. Tell your friends or listen and subscribe on Apple, Stitcher, Spotify or wherever you like to listen, and rate and review as well. To continue the conversation, find me on Instagram and Twitter @thesineadburke and find Lemonada Media on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook @LemonadaMedia.


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