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Today on Wiser Than Me, Julia welcomes 80-year-old singer, actress, and entrepreneur Patti LaBelle. The two discuss Patti’s legendary Grammy Award-winning music career and what the “Godmother of Soul” has cooked for friends like Nina Simone, Elton John, and Prince. Plus, Patti tells Julia why she was convinced she wouldn’t live to see 50. Also, Julia asks her 90-year-old mom, Judith, if she can remember any racy song lyrics from her youth.

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Transcript

SPEAKERS

Patti LaBelle, Julia Louis-Dreyfus, Mommy

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  00:00

So I’m not good at technical things. If it’s digital, I can’t do it, or, really, I won’t do it. I mean, I’m sure I’m missing out on a lot of stuff, but in the end, who really gives a shit? I get by just fine, thanks. Except for one thing, music. I love to listen to music. It’s one of the three or four things I enjoy most in life. When I was in high school and college, we had a record player, a record player. Remember those, oh my god, the hours and hours that I would listen to music slap Stevie Wonder’s talking book on the turntable, place the needle on the record. Music comes out of the speakers. Nothing to it. And then records died. Fine, whatever stick the Stevie Wonder CD in the thing, press play. I could do that. And look, I certainly don’t want to be the Well back in my day kind of person, especially on a show about how older women make such valuable contributions right now, but now it’s all Spotify and Apple Music, and that’s great when I’ve got my phone in my pocket and my ear things in but what about when I want to dance around my kitchen? What is washing dishes, you know, without Ray Charles blaring or Parliament Funkadelic when you’re making the bed? Okay? I can’t make that happen, and we have what the rest of my family claims is a very straightforward system that is utter and complete bullshit. But here I am, they say, with every song ever recorded, and I think they’re like, 100 million songs on Spotify or something, all right, there at my fingertips. And how often do I listen to music in my own home if I’m alone, never. Seriously, I’m not kidding you, never. And what a giant law set is. Our house used to be filled with music. I remember making cassette tapes of playlists when our kids were born. Oh my god. Music for nap time, music for waking up, just music, music. Our house was full of music, and it made such an imprint on our boys. For example, our son, Henry, he started playing guitar in middle school, and when he was in high school, he was in a jazz band. So at Christmas, the school would have a holiday concert, and the jazz band played a song or two. So fantastic. And these were always instrumentals, right? But at this concert, at the end, they bring out a microphone, and our Henry, in his little suit and tie, steps up to the microphone, and he says, this is tenderness. By Paul Simon, okay, look, we had no idea this was gonna happen. He hadn’t said anything, nothing. So the band plays that first chord. Do you know that song?

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  02:56

And Henry starts to sing his version of that song. And it was shocking. I mean, we knew he could sing, he was in a good rock band, but this what we’d never heard him do this. It was like a complete transformation. It was transporting, and it came out of nowhere. It’s like a movie. We were so astonished, and girls were they’re all screaming, and Henry’s voice was like sailing up higher and higher, because he has this gorgeous tenor voice. And his dad and I looked at each other and we knew without a doubt that this guy was going to be a singer, a musician. And of course, that’s exactly what he is. In fact, he writes the music for this podcast. Do yourself a favor and listen to him on Spotify, if you can figure out how to work it. Because, seriously, he is just unusually good. And I say that as a music critic, not as his mother. And God damn it, I want to hear my own son’s music on Spotify loud in my kitchen, which, okay, so this brings me back to my technical infirmities. Henry had a live show a couple of nights ago at a great venue here in Los Angeles called Zebulon. I bought tickets online, and when we got to Zebulon, I brought the tickets up on my phone, and I tried to get up the Cure thing, or whatever the fuck it is, and I can’t do it. And of course, there are people behind us in the line, and the show’s coming up, and I don’t want to hold up the line, and the nice kid at the box office offers to help me. Ma’am. He says, oh God. And I see this very handsome young door guy watching this, and he’s smiling, he’s laughing a little bit at me, and I’m thinking, Oh, come on what? I’m that lady. I’m the one who can’t figure out her own telephone, please. The world has passed me by, God, damn it. But then the scanner went deep, and we went in and the show started. And in 30 seconds, none of that mattered, because the music was not just good, it was spectacular. Yeah, and there I was doing one of the three or four things I love the most, listening to great music. And really, everything else fell away. Nothing else mattered. I was completely lost in it. Looking at my Henry on stage, I could see the direct line between his high school jazz band and this night. And I was completely happy. Because really, is there anything better than the simple pleasure of a good singer singing a good song, especially a singer you love with all your heart? So how wonderful then that today we are talking to the great Patti LaBelle.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  05:48

I’m Julia Louis-Dreyfus, and this is Wiser Than Me, the podcast where I get schooled by women who are wiser than me. In 1954 a very shy 10 year old girl walked up to Beulah Baptist Church in West Philadelphia for the first time. So shy, in fact, that until that day, her mother had to convince her to go outside and play with other kids by paying her a quarter each time. But in that church, things started to change for her. Under the guidance of Miss Harriet Chapman, her choir director, gospel songs began to fill her head. The solos came. Standing ovations started to roll in, people saying that girl sure can sing. Miss Harriet told our guest, never stop singing. Whatever you do, don’t stop. And guess what? Patti LaBelle is not stopping. You could, right now, go see Patti LaBelle perform live where you’d hear her sing incredible hits like the original Lady Marmalade on my own and new attitude, what you can expect at a Patti LaBelle show is drama, shoes flying and a damn good time. That personality on stage, that big voice, and 18 studio albums have rightfully earned her the title of the godmother of soul beyond music, she’s an accomplished entrepreneur, actress and a New York Times best selling author of several incredible cookbooks. She has transformed her culinary talent into a multi million dollar empire with her brand good life, which includes her viral sweet potato pies. Mastering one craft is challenging enough, but my God, Patti LaBelle has mastered many in 2023 she was named one of Forbes magazine’s 50 over 50. She’s a Grammy winner, an NAACP Image Award winner, a GLAAD Media Award recipient, and an inductee into the Grammy Hall of Fame. Yet the accolades she has received are not for her alone, a core part of who Patti is involves helping others, and I can’t wait to talk about that. Patty was one of the first recording artists to support aids causes in the 80s and 90s, and is still a fierce advocate for gay rights, not to mention her band label performed in the gay bathhouse circuit, the same that launched Bette Midler and Barry Manilow in the 70s. Most recently, she launched a consulting firm called Z Pack dedicated to assisting bipoc And women owned food businesses in getting their products onto the shelves of big box retailers. She is taking what she has learned and is helping others succeed a positive force, force all caps, in a troubled and so often negative time, and that is why I am deeply thrilled to be talking today to an icon, a mother, a grandmother and entrepreneur who is so much wiser than me. Patti LaBelle, Patti, you’re giving me goosebumps. Just talking about this is giving me goosebumps for real.

 

Patti LaBelle  09:02

Oh, thank you so much. Joy is giving me goosebumps talking to you.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  09:07

It’s a delight.

 

Patti LaBelle  09:08

Thank you.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  09:08

Thank you so Patty, are you comfortable? If I ask your real age?

 

Patti LaBelle  09:13

I’m 80. 80, and happy, yeah, a good 80.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  09:17

How old do you feel, Patti?

 

Patti LaBelle  09:19

I feel 30.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  09:20

You do?

 

Patti LaBelle  09:21

Yes, I feel 30 and the 80 is working. It’s working. I’ve never been ashamed of saying, my graduation whenever I turn 75 that’s a graduation, I graduate each day in age, which some some ladies and men are afraid to say how how old they are. And my sisters all died early in the early 40s. Yes, so whenever I made 50, I knew I had graduated, you know, and every every other year was just like putting on another year that they didn’t make it so. I’m honored to be 80.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  10:01

Oh, boy, is that something I was going to ask you, what’s the best part about being your age, but you just answered it. I mean, I love the idea of thinking of aging, because graduating that’s so cool, because it implies what you’ve learned. It implies an education, doesn’t it?

 

Patti LaBelle  10:16

Oh, it does. A true education. I have learned at every age something great and something that you say to yourself, well maybe because my family died young, I might not make it to 70, and I did, and I’m 80 and still striving and still realizing it’s a blessing.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  10:39

And now here you are, and I have to say for our listeners, looking positively exquisite. Patty’s wearing this gorgeous white top with a multiple strands of pearls and honestly, short bob haircut, you look divine.

 

Patti LaBelle  10:55

Thank you, Julia.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  10:57

So this year you celebrated your 80th birthday, and I understand your son, Zuri, surprised you, and you said you’re really hard to surprise. I can’t believe the pictures I saw from your party. That was a crazy party. How did you I need to know details about it. How did you know, like, what to wear? How did he get you there without you knowing.

 

Patti LaBelle  11:20

I knew at 80 I was gonna have a big, big party, yes, so my friend Zane toy made a beautiful dress for me before I knew where the party would be or any detail, yes, but I knew I had to celebrate with a beautiful dress, yeah. So I got the dress, and I kept saying to my Son, why don’t you just tell me? He said, tell you what. I said, Just tell me where it’s gonna be Yeah, because I know it’s gonna be Yeah. And so then he told me this big story one day about I had to get dressed because we’re having a meeting with Walmart. I said, since when do I have to get dressed? Dressed up for meeting with Walmart, but I did.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  12:01

Wait a minute. Were you suspicious or did you buy into it?

 

Patti LaBelle  12:04

Of course, I was no. I was suspicious because I knew he was lying. I knew it wasn’t going to be a party with Walmart, but because I am who I am, I got dressed and put on that beautiful blue dress, yes. And said, Let me, let him think that I don’t know any better. And then we went to the party. It was in New York, because I live in Philadelphia, and so I knew it was going to be a fabulous night. And when I walked in the door, all my friends were there. God, everybody that I loved in show business from back in the day, friends that I hadn’t seen in 20 years, just so many wonderful people, yes, who enjoyed celebrating with Patti, yeah.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  12:48

So good. I love this, you tour eight to 11 months out of the year. Is that still the case?

 

Patti LaBelle  12:55

Oh yeah. I tour all the time. A lot of people think that I’ve stopped singing. I said, Oh, no, Google me, honey. I’m on tour a lot.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  13:03

So can you just talk about the realities of keeping your voice in shape? What is your routine?

 

Patti LaBelle  13:09

I have no routine to keep my voice in shape. No, routine. No not at all.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  13:15

Stop it. Don’t you drink tea or anything? Do you warm up?

 

Patti LaBelle  13:20

Tea, I know I don’t warm up either. I think I’m a bad person to not. No, you’re not do the things that most singers do. I just wake up and I could sing perfectly in the morning at six or seven in the morning. So that that’s a blessing. And I never, I’ve never done anything to make this happen. I’ve never had lessons. I’ve never I’m just a whatever I am.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  13:49

Do you have perfect pitch?

 

Patti LaBelle  13:51

I have perfect pitch.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  13:52

You do?

 

Patti LaBelle  13:52

Uh huh, yes. Thank god.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  13:55

That is so cool. You’ve had so many wonderful and deep friendships with people that we know, you know as icons like Prince and Mick Jagger and Nina Simone and one through line, through all of this, is that you have, in addition to knowing them as artists and being with them as artists, you’ve cooked meals for them.

 

Patti LaBelle  14:18

I’ve cooked for so many. Richard Pryor for, of course, the Rolling Stones. Elton John was my piano player back in the day, and so his band would come to my flat after the shows, and we play cards for money, and they lost every time they didn’t have any pounds, no pounds. So I won all the pounds and sent them home with Tupperware with food every night we played because they couldn’t afford food, right? So here’s the story with Elton tell so we were buddies, buddies, buddies, and so he called me one night and said, Hello, Patty. I’m not gonna do his accent because I can’t. He said, Hello, Patty. I. I said, Yeah. He said, This is me, Elton, no. Reggie. Oh. I said, Reggie. Because he was Reggie White, his band was blue, zoology, I think, and he was Reggie at that time. He was not Elton John.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  15:12

Was that he was born Reggie? Was that his birth name?

 

Patti LaBelle  15:15

Yes, and so he called me and said, Patty, it’s Reggie. I said, Oh, hey, Reg, he said, I want you to come to my show tonight. I said, a show where he said, at the spectrum in Philadelphia. So I said, Oh, who are you opening for? Yeah, he said, I’m Elton John. Now, I said, you have a did I tell him some bad things? I said, you made it before me, honey, yes, and it was just a beautiful, beautiful moment. And so later, we recorded together in Vegas, when he did the red piano show in Vegas, yes. And we, we recorded a duet together. And after this song was done, he had taken his rings off, yes. And I said, so here, here are your rings, Elton. And he said, No, that’s for your Tupperware that you gave me back in the day. So he paid me. He paid me with a beautiful ring.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  16:07

Yeah, oh my goodness. Do you still have that ring?

 

Patti LaBelle  16:11

I have it upstairs in my box, yes.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  16:14

Dying to see what that ring looks like.

 

Patti LaBelle  16:16

I’m keeping that ring.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  16:18

Of course, you are.

 

Patti LaBelle  16:19

Do you know what that ring is, Kim I could show you.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  16:22

Would you show me?

 

Patti LaBelle  16:23

Could you did it? I would love to see it’s so beautiful, it’s so manly. So I never wear it, yeah.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  16:31

But it’s so meaningful, and the story behind it, because what he did was, you made food for him, but then he kept the Tupperware, and he didn’t return it, and that that kind of bugged you, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  16:43

It’s because I love to get my shopping bags if I give you food and my Tupperware bag.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  16:47

Well, I understand that. It makes sense. It’s kind of rude not to give it back.

 

Patti LaBelle  16:52

I love my Tupperware and my shopping bag. Good shopping bags. Yes. So he did pay me back that day at Caesars when we were recording, after the recording session, he gave me the ring that he had taken off to play the song. And he’s a good friend. Yeah, I have so many friends in this business of Prince who wanted me to cook for him. So he took me to his home, and they went grocery shopping for me, his his, his people. And when I made about eight items or more, the only thing he ate were the biscuits.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  17:29

What was he not a big eater? What’s the deal? Well, he was kind of a small man.

 

Patti LaBelle  17:33

He is small. So he made me cook all that food, and he ate a biscuit. I said, What’s up? He said, That’s all I wanted. I just wanted to see you cook. Oh, my God. And then he took me to his it was a disco, a club. Before that, he had outfits made for me at his studio, because he had a tailor shop in his building. Is this in Minneapolis and Minneapolis, and he had four outfits made for me. And then I cooked for him that day. And then that night, he took me to the club, and we danced and we drove in the alphabet car. Oh, you remember the alphabet car? Sure, I do so many wonderful memories with those guys.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  18:13

Did you enjoy collaborating with him, in particular as an artist? Was it sort of, was it an elevated experience, Patti?

 

Patti LaBelle  18:20

It was more than that. And the thing is, sometimes producers make you record a song like 2030, 4050, times for that one song. When we did our song, yo, mister, he said, That’s it on the first take. No way. He did not want a second take. He said, Because the first take was magic, and I appreciate that so much, because sometimes you get in a studio and they make you work, work, work, work, when you think you had it in the first five takes, and sometimes you’ll continue to record, continue it and and then they end up using maybe the first or the second. But Prince knew he wanted that one take.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  18:57

Isn’t that fascinating? I mean, he was an artist. He was a true artist. Oh, boy, here comes the ring. Here comes the ring. Oh, my gosh. Oh, it’s beautiful. It’s a diamond ring, and it looks like it has crosses on it, right? Like four different crosses, and it’s like a it looks like it’s pave diamond, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  19:23

It’s so heavy, and just so.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  19:25

It’s heavy, but, you know, it’s beautiful. And Patti, I have to tell you something, I think you can get away with wearing that. I don’t think that looks too manly on your hand at all.

 

Patti LaBelle  19:33

It doesn’t really fit on the fingers. That out like this finger is too small. This one, it’s kind of big on it. It’s a big Yeah, it’s a little too big my fingers, and it doesn’t fit on this one.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  19:45

Well, you could have it sized patty. I’m just telling you, I’m in favor of you wearing that ring. I love it.

 

Patti LaBelle  19:50

You’re in favor of me wearing it. Well, I’ll get it fitted.  So I still have my ring. Elton. Yeah, I have it.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  20:02

That is beautiful. And I love that story about Prince, too. And I also, I also, I understand that you travel. I mean, you’re such a cook, and you love to cook so much. You travel with spices. What are the spices you travel with? You must have very specific ones.

 

Patti LaBelle  20:16

Oh my gosh, in season, I travel with habanero peppers because they’re the hottest, and monkey peppers, bird peppers, anything that’s hot. Jalapenos are not so hot, but the habaneros are crazy blazing hot. So I carry those. I carry fresh garlic, I carry certain sea salts and grape seed oil. I travel with, Oh, interesting. And when we get to the town, we’ll find a farmer’s market to get the fish and, you know, fresh foods, fresh meats and fresh vegetables, yes. And I make sure I have those, and I carry my pots and pans on the road.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  20:55

And so if you’re going to a farmer’s market, and you’re, I’m kind of going off topic here, but I’m so interested to know, okay, when you’re going to a farmer’s market like that in whatever town you’re in, I’m assuming you’re kind of maybe making things up as you go along, because you don’t know what you’re going to come across at the farmers market, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  21:11

Never know. No, you never know. So I’m very spontaneous when it comes to cooking and having to go to a store. If they don’t have what I really need. I’ll find it, yeah, and if not, I’ll improvise, you know.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  21:25

I love that the I wish you live close to me, because I’ve got, I have a huge serrano chili plant right now. It has a lot of chilies on it, and I’d be, and I don’t need to eat a lot of those, and I would be so happy to send them your way.

 

Patti LaBelle  21:39

But send them away whenever we’ll get them.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  21:45

It’s time to take a quick break. We’ll be back with Patti LaBelle in just a few moments.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  22:01

So you grew up as the second youngest of five children, correct?

 

Patti LaBelle  22:06

Yes.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  22:06

And as I said before, you were very shy. But now, now look at you. You have such you have this huge social life, yes, when, when did you grow out of that? How did, what was this evolution for you?

 

Patti LaBelle  22:22

I don’t remember how old I was when I became not so shy, but it was so bad my mother would pay me a quarter to go out and play with kids, right? And the quarter wore out, and I wore out with people. So I said, I’m coming back home. Oh, I was just too shy to to deal with people. Of course, that changed in years, because now I’m around so many wonderful people, and so many things that I do now include people. So I was just born a shy girl.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  22:53

Do you ever feel that shyness coming back, Patti?

 

Patti LaBelle  22:55

Yes, every now and then it comes back.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  22:58

And how do you manage it? And tell me how it comes back. I’m so curious.

 

Patti LaBelle  23:02

It comes back at moments, and I can’t explain why it comes back at times, but when it does, it leaves quickly, because I can’t handle it. I know that I have to be out of that shy state to do what I do before we go on stage, we pray, and when I see the audience, that brings me back to not being so shy because they’re so giving.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  23:26

So you feel, you feel the energy from the audience.

 

Patti LaBelle  23:29

Energy from the audience. And when you go out, you never know what audience you’re gonna have. You don’t know if they’ve never seen you before. If they’re trying to say, Okay, we’re going to give this chick a try. And then when I get out, one of the things that I say in the middle of the show, how many people are seeing me for the first time? And maybe 80% of the audience raised their hand, and so then I said, Well, fasten your seat belts, because it’s going to be a bumpy ride. And I hope you will come back to see me once you see me tonight.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  24:02

I love that you take the energy and it kind of lifts you up. It’s like arms outstretched to you. And I think that’s phenomenal. Yeah, so Patty, going back to your musical beginnings, your older brother introduced you to jazz, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  24:14

Yes, he was a Nina Simone, James moody fanatic, and I learned to love jazz, I mean, because of him.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  24:23

Right, and then I’m jumping ahead here, but then you got to know Nina Simone personally, didn’t you?

 

Patti LaBelle  24:31

She was my good friend. Yes, we would talk maybe once every two weeks.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  24:36

Goodness.

 

Patti LaBelle  24:37

She was just a wonderful friend. And we talked about food, we talked about she talked about everything with me.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  24:45

What did you learn from her? What did you learn from Nina Simone?

 

Patti LaBelle  24:49

Well, there was a time where we’re doing a show at Carnegie Hall with Sting Elton. Oh, my God. A few wonderful people. Crystal, and she was with me, and I asked for a glass of wine, and they brought it to me in a plastic cup. She said, Oh no, darling, you never drink out of plastic crystal. Only, Crystal only, you know, it’s just, she was just like a teacher and just.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  25:18

But, she said, but that can’t be the only thing you learned from her, to drink out of crystal.

 

Patti LaBelle  25:22

Her music. I mean, she was so she was one of a kind. She was way ahead of most people, yeah, for the rights of the right people, that’s right, yeah. So, I mean, I learned that I I just stayed with her whenever she would call, or I would call her and was just like, Mother lessons. You know that she was just mother lessons, yeah, just just her, her period was a blessing to me. Yeah, I can just say she was like, one of my better friends in life, not just musically, just life, things that happen in life, and just a strong, strong woman she was.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  26:04

And I believe you cook for her too, at particularly, like at the end of her life.

 

Patti LaBelle  26:08

I did, I was at, I think we were at the London hotel in New York. I can’t remember the name of the hotel. We were saying at the same hotel, because we were doing the Carnegie Hall Show, yes, and she was in my hotel, and so she called me and said, Patty, what are you doing? So I said, I’m making lunch. And so she said, What are you making? I said, I’m making hot sausage. I mean, they were really hot from the farmer’s market in Philly. I brought them with me to New York, and she said, I would like one. And so I went up to a room, and she was there in her, her way of being at that time. And my friend, Norma, who does my hair, came up with me. She said, No, no, not Norma, just you. So I went in and gave her the hot sausage, and she She just showed me what she was going through. It was very personal, and she just opened up to me, and when she ate it, I said, now you’re going to need a lot of water to go after that. Hot, hot. So she said, after she finished, she said, Go make me another one. And they were, they were on fire. I said, Are you my kind of girl? Yeah. So wow, we had quite great personal moments, just as a friend.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  27:25

That’s just so beautiful. So you had three sisters. What was the dynamic like between you and your sisters when you were growing up?

 

Patti LaBelle  27:34

Oh, God, the dynamic with my sisters, we fought.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  27:38

You did.

 

Patti LaBelle  27:38

We loved, we hugged, we we had issues with crabs, hard shell crabs. What do you mean? Issues? Issues? Because we all loved hard shell crabs, male crabs, a gigantic one, yeah. So we would get bushels of crabs on the weekend, and so whenever they were cooked, I would go in the pot first and take the bigger ones, and my sisters would hate me for this. Why don’t you always have to get the big ones, and they will say a few curse words to me. I said, because I can, you know, so we would have fights about my taking the big crabs. And it always ended up that I got the bigger ones because I, I was a I was a picker. I knew how to get in that pot and pick before they got in the kitchen. Just crazy things. But we loved each other, but we fought like sisters.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  28:28

And they were very fashionable, too. I understand, right, your sisters, weren’t they?

 

Patti LaBelle  28:32

Oh, I used to wear my sisters, Vivian, when she went to work, I would get her clothes and wear them to school, and she would come back and say, somebody’s been in my clothes because I never put them back properly, you know. So, yeah, we had fights about that, but she was a dressing woman, yes, really, yes. She knew how to dress.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  28:53

Maybe you got a sense of fashion from her, because actually, your outfits, when you are with LaBelle, those outfits were completely ahead of their time. Don’t you think?

 

Patti LaBelle  29:03

Oh God, they were ahead. Yes, they were.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  29:06

They really were. I mean, you really kind of, I mean, you, I think I even heard you say we were, we were Lady Gaga before there was Lady Gaga, the way you would come out and present yourselves, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  29:19

Gaga and Madonna, before they were kiss the great they wanted to dress like, like our outfits. So they got in touch with our designer, Larry Legaspi, and said, Yeah, we want to have some things like label and so, right, he made things for them. Was such a compliment. It was a compliment when Gaga or Madonna, like Sarah dash wore the beautiful silver breast plates, Madonna wore them, and it was after they saw Sarah with them, and it was so many compliments thrown our way because we did it first.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  29:55

Yes, of course, in your memoir, you talk about. Having low self esteem as a child, which we discussed, and you didn’t consider yourself beautiful, which I find astounding, by the way, because you are truly a beauty.

 

Patti LaBelle  30:10

Well, thank you. I never saw myself as beautiful. I I saw myself as a real woman looking the way I look, not wanting to make any difference on my face, but I did. I had a nose job, you know, and that didn’t make me any prettier. It just took away some of the some of the nose. But I, uh, I’ve learned lately that it doesn’t really matter what you look like. It doesn’t, you know, I dress up and get made up and haired up for the shows, because I’m in show business. But if not, I’ll be just like, right now, I’m not really basically made, made up or haired up. I’m Julia upped, you know. So this is kind of, kind of quiet.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  30:57

This is quiet I mean, honestly, I cannot I think you look spectacular, and you could go to the Academy Awards looking the way you do right now that you What do you mean that you learned it lately. You said I learned lately that what you look like doesn’t really matter.

 

Patti LaBelle  31:15

Because I realize what I am inside. I am a person with a good heart and makeup and the hair is not going to make me a better person. It’s not going to make me a better person. As I’ve gotten older, I’ve realized that that that does not make me, it doesn’t make me, as long as I can sing and perform and make somebody happy, that’s good. Sometimes I say I could just do it with a pair of jeans, not with a awesome costume or something, because they came to see Patti LaBelle, they didn’t come to see the costume. Although I’m a dress and drag queen, I do. Dress up, I do. Yeah, and it feels good, but I realize that we can’t put all that emphasis on how we look all the time.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  32:03

Yeah, it can be exhausting, right? It is. And you have this musical instrument, and that’s your that blessing is the one.

 

Patti LaBelle  32:11

That’s my basic, yeah, that’s your life, the music life.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  32:16

Yes, when you were with the bluebells, the group was you, Sarah dash, Nona Hendricks and Cindy bird song, and then Cindy left, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  32:26

Cindy left to go join The Supremes.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  32:29

The Supremes in 1967 at the time that that happened, Did that shake your confidence?

 

Patti LaBelle  32:41

When it happened, it shook my confidence, because it happened, it did. It was not knowledge of our group that she was leaving to go with the Supremes. And so we were performing in Cleveland, I think, and we were waiting for her to come down, and she never came down, you know, to go to the dressing room. And so somehow we found out, I think it was the next night that she had joined The Supremes.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  33:10

You didn’t even find out from her, you just found it out from some other way.

 

Patti LaBelle  33:14

We found the time. I don’t remember exactly how, but it wasn’t from it wasn’t from Cindy. Now she did not call us, and I just felt so betrayed and just so sad, sure. And then I thought about it, I said maybe, if I were in her position, and one of the best selling female groups asked me to join them, I might have said yes, because they were making much more money than we were, yes, so I kind of understood her reasoning after a while, and then I prayed for and I said, wish you the best of luck, you know. So I had to take it, and I had to not dislike her for that.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  33:57

Yeah, it’s just the way she went about it. Maybe it was a mistake, yes, yeah, yeah. Have you had conversations with her subsequently, and come to come to a peaceful place.

 

Patti LaBelle  34:08

With her and Diana, you know? So it was something that, at the time Diana wanted to do, and Barry go, or whoever they wanted to replace Florence Ballard, right? And she was very close to looking like Florence Ballard and sounding like Florence Ballard, I see. So after a while, I realized that they did what they had to do, right? And I did what I had to do, and that was to keep on keeping on, keep on keeping on. Yeah, I couldn’t hold that anger. I couldn’t hold it any longer.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  34:38

Yeah, because it’ll eat you up.

 

Patti LaBelle  34:40

Yes. And we since then, we’ve talked Diana and I have talked we’re friends, good, you know, so there’s no hard feelings at this time. So it’s a done deal.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  34:51

That’s a done deal that’s finished. Now, you went, you started going to therapy, I think you did around the time that. Cindy left the group. Is that right?

 

Patti LaBelle  35:02

No, I went to therapy after the group broke up. Oh, after Yes, up, with me, Sarah and Nona, when we broke up as a group, I didn’t want to be blamed as the one who left the group. I didn’t want to be sometimes they said Diana Ross was the reason they broke up the Supremes or whatever? Yes, I didn’t want it to be said that Patti LaBelle broke the group up, I see. So I had to go to therapy because it was hard for me to go out on that stage some night solo, without them. But the reason we broke up is because the three of us wanted to do different music, sure, and so to stay together as a group, we’d be lying to the public, so we had to make that move. And like I said, we’re still talking yesterday, me and Nona, we lost Sarah, which is so sad, but we’re still the best of friends. But at that time, I needed help. I needed a shrink.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  36:01

Yeah, I get it. I mean, I think endings are very difficult. They can be really difficult for me too. I mean, not that I had a fabulous girl group, but you know when, when jobs, and particularly long standing jobs, yes, that can be a ground shift cancer. It’s scary. It’s scary. It’s totally scary.

 

Patti LaBelle  36:25

Because you don’t know who’s gonna blame you for the breakup, you know, at that time.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  36:29

But also, don’t you, it’s sort of like, who am I without that, you know? It’s so many things.

 

Patti LaBelle  36:35

So many things go through your mind, a so you have to, like, deal with it, and that my way of dealing was to see somebody I had to get help.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  36:46

Smart. There’s much more with Patti LaBelle after this break, don’t go anywhere you

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  37:04

So, Patti, what was it like earlier in your career touring in the South? Because, I mean, on one hand, you’re building up this fan base and a name for yourself, but on the other hand, it’s the height of Jim Crow?

 

Patti LaBelle  37:18

Yeah, it was bad. We traveled in a station wagon, you know, throughout the south, and there were times when we couldn’t get a hotel, so we stayed in the station wagon. We will buy our tuna and chocolate candy bars and whatever, and just stay in the station wagon because there were no hotels that were gonna really let us board. Wow, in the south there were some black hotels, you know that we were fine, but we were not allowed to dwell in those the white hotels. So we spent a lot of time in the station wagon. And we realized that for us, that was all there was. And so you take it, or you leave it, you fight it, or you settle. So we had to settle because we couldn’t change the laws, you know, and it didn’t take anything away from us as far as our performance. We still work. But you really have to know that there was a big, big, big difference in white acts and black acts. And what it did for us was just grew us up.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  38:29

Yeah, I bet really quickly it did really quickly.

 

Patti LaBelle  38:33

It grew us up, you know? So when we when we did our thing, we did it with knowing that there was going to be a lot of rejection, and you live with it, or you fight it, it made us stronger. That’s what I’m saying. Every lesson wasn’t a negative ending. Yes, every lesson that we dealt with grew us up, yeah, and realize that we’re not going to be treated the way we want to be treated all the time, you know? So the way you’re treated is the way you’re going to live with and the way you’re going to expect, and then when it changes, that’s like a big old rose, Oh, it wasn’t so bad that night. But, you know, that wasn’t often. So we did that, and we did it knowing what we’re going to go into, yeah, we knew it was going to be great all the time.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  39:18

And it must have just, you must have formed a bond with those women like no other, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  39:24

We created this love for each other, I mean, that we weren’t gonna get from most people traveling, so we just grew to hold on to each other and to make each other laugh and play jokes on each other and just have fun. Yeah, you know, because what we had to do to get there. Wasn’t always great.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  39:42

Right, wow. God. I mean, You’ve nurtured relationships with so many artists like Jennifer Hudson and Fantasia. God, I love Fantasia and Mariah Carey, and you said that you didn’t want them to make the same mistakes you made. What are the some of the. Important lessons that you’ve learned in your life that you shared with them.

 

Patti LaBelle  40:03

Of course, I share with all of them what we went through at beginning of our careers. Labelle Patti, Labelle and the blue labels, the things that we went through in the south, the things that we took for granted would come for us, and it never did. But you you tell all these like I talked to them. Fantasia. Jennifer, Mariah, like you said, all my little girls, and they, they will call me every now and then for information, for just some kind of something that I’ve gone through, that they might be going through, interesting. And so I’m, like, a godmother, yeah. Godmother.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  40:42

And you’ve always been very, I mean, you’ve had an incredible eye for spotting talent, right? Like Luther Vandross, by the way,  and Elton John.

 

Patti LaBelle  40:51

And Elton John, yeah, it’s Luther was our first fan club president, but he will come to the Apollo Theater with clothes for us. Yeah. So I said, Oh, who is this man with all these gowns? He had, like, four gowns. They were, wow, pink and gray, beautiful gowns. And so, of course, we he had all of our sizes and everything, really. And so I said, Well, what else do you do other than bring clothes? He said, I sing. I said, Oh, really. And so I said, sing. And he sang. I said, Honey, you shouldn’t be Pele in these clothes. You should have a microphone and go out and make yourself a living with your voice. And then we became good friends, and he became our first fan club president.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  41:37

And then,  did he launch his own career after that?

 

Patti LaBelle  41:40

Yeah, because he was singing a lot backgrounds with different people at the time, I think that we met him, I’m not sure, but he ended up making his own life the best life for him, singing not background, but singing lead.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  41:56

Yeah, of course. And I’m so struck by your generosity, who modeled all this generosity for you, who was generous with you the way you are so generous with others.

 

Patti LaBelle  42:06

My mother, yes, and my father, yes. They were very giving people, yes. And my sisters were also very, very much givers. And so I took a lot of that from them.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  42:22

Hey, listen when the night birds came out in 1974 right? And that was the first huge, big hit album, yes, for you guys. And the lead single was Lady Marmalade. You know, I have to tell you something that is such a formative tune, I mean, as it is for millions of people, but I was 13 when that song came out, and I couldn’t believe that song. It was so sexy, yeah, and I used to sing that, and you could, you could sing it because it was in French, so you could kind of get away with it. And I just remember feeling so kind of like, what’s the word? Like a rebel singing that tune loud in my house. You know what I mean, along with you guys, did you know it was going to be a hit?

 

Patti LaBelle  43:09

I knew it was going to be a hit, but I didn’t know what bully Bucha meant.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  43:13

Get out of town.

 

Patti LaBelle  43:14

I’m serious, honey. Had no clue it meant, will you sleep with me tonight? So when we heard it when we went to Alan too, saying to record night verbs. I said, Let’s make this our first song to record for this album. Uh huh, as a song was recorded, we knew it was a hit. And after it was out, we had some some interesting people saying, wow, why are they singing about a hooker? It was nuns talking about, oh, that group is not, not nice. We’re singing about hookers. I had no clue what voo Liu meant, and so we.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  43:50

Amazing.

 

Patti LaBelle  43:51

We got a little.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  43:54

Blow back for that.

 

Patti LaBelle  43:56

But who cares? Continue to sing it. Yeah. You know, it’s like I said, a Lady Marmalade hooker as a hooker, I’m not, but I’m singing it. Yes, oh, God, interesting song.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  44:09

Yeah, it’s a great song. It’s incredible. Labelle did the gay bathhouse circuit, right? And also, yeah, and also the first black group to play Metropolitan Opera House, which is incredible. I saw that poster. I just thought that poster for that show is so beautiful. It’s It’s bananas.

 

Patti LaBelle  44:30

Oh gosh. We were at the Metropolitan Opera House, the first black group to play, yes, and the show was called, wear something silver. And so everybody came with silver outfits, the cycle sluts. They came. It was some I don’t know if Cher was there that night, but that’s when I think I came from the ceiling, flying down, singing night birds. And we just had a crazy, wonderful night at the Metropolitan Opera House. Yes, and we did play the bath houses.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  45:03

I know you and […]

 

Patti LaBelle  45:04

Bette Midler, did it. Midler, we did that, and guess what happened?

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  45:10

Tell me.

 

Patti LaBelle  45:10

At the bath house.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  45:12

What?

 

Patti LaBelle  45:12

I went to the machine thinking it was bubble gum.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  45:15

Oh, no.

 

Patti LaBelle  45:16

And so we put money and it was condoms. They look like bubble gum. Things falling out. I said, What the hell is this?

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  45:24

I hope you didn’t put it in your mouth and try to chew it.

 

Patti LaBelle  45:26

Oh, no, but it was Sarah. They laughed. They laughed so hard. Yeah, we were putting money in the machine getting bubble gum. I thought

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  45:34

did did you get blow back for that, for playing in bath houses?

 

Patti LaBelle  45:38

Never did we get blow back for playing in bath houses, good, at least. I don’t know about it, right? I don’t think so.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  45:44

But I mean, you, you have been so accepting of the gay community from way back in the day, and maybe at a time when it was not as widely acceptable to be gay, right? But you were, you were.

 

Patti LaBelle  45:58

Yeah, I have had a gay following from the beginning. Sarah Nona and myself and Cindy, we had a gay following, which I take as a compliment.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  46:08

Of course, yeah, without question. And I think I have a gay following too, by the way. I think I have, I bet you do. I don’t know how to make that determine. Oh, I’m being told that I do. So we have that in common, and I’m grateful for it. Patty, I learned this fact about you that just blew me away. So here you are at the top of your game, but in your 40s, you used to say farewell to your fans after every show, because you really believed you would not live beyond 50, right?

 

Patti LaBelle  46:41

Because, given all my sisters, yeah, I thought all your sisters that it wouldn’t last long.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  46:47

Yes, I did. And your friend Claudette, too, who passed away young.

 

Patti LaBelle  46:51

Right.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  46:53

Patti can you talk about living with that fear at at the time of your mammoth success? Because that the they bump up against each other, don’t they? The feeling of, I’m not going to make it, but you’ve made it at the same time as an artist.

 

Patti LaBelle  47:10

Of course, you would think that, I mean, after I turned a certain age, I would say, well, am I next? Yeah, as far as going through what my sisters went through, that’s right. And when I turned a certain age, I just said, Well, God is with me when it’s my turn, it’s my time.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  47:30

Is that? But is that when you turn 50? I think, is that right?

 

Patti LaBelle  47:33

After I turned 50? Yes, and I just said every day, something could happen, and it didn’t, it didn’t, and I’m still standing, you know, so I just thank God for all the time that I have and all the time that I have left.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  47:52

And so but you had a lot of anxiety about it, and then all of a sudden, it seems like that anxiety just it left.

 

Patti LaBelle  47:59

It left.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  48:00

It just left.

 

Patti LaBelle  48:00

Yes.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  48:01

That’s good.

 

Patti LaBelle  48:02

The anxiety left. Yes, it did.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  48:06

Maybe it was just the marker of getting past a certain age. Yeah, I had a I lost my sister, actually, and she was 44.

 

Patti LaBelle  48:16

If you really, oh yeah, she wages is mine.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  48:19

I know, yeah. So I was so struck by that in your life.

 

Patti LaBelle  48:23

What does she pass from?

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  48:26

She was just really ill. And, yeah, sorry. So, yeah, really tragic, but it so upends your life, because it’s not the way the world is supposed to work? No, it’s not the order of things, and that’s why it’s hard to kind of, well, that’s why you’re frightened,

 

Patti LaBelle  48:47

That’s why it’s natural.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  48:51

Yeah, it’s natural because it doesn’t feel it’s natural to be frightened because it’s so unnatural.

 

Patti LaBelle  48:58

And never know when it’s gonna happen.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  49:01

Right, exactly, right.

 

Patti LaBelle  49:03

Well, I’m sorry.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  49:04

Thank you. I’m sorry for you too. Thank you. I’m sorry for you too. And you’ve been very open about when your sister Jackie passed away, and you’ve come to terms with what do you mind talking about that right now?

 

Patti LaBelle  49:19

Well, she wanted me to prepare her lunch, egg sandwich, fried egg sandwich, because I made great sandwiches. And she was around the corner at the hospital, yeah, where I lived at the time. I moved since then, and my aunt was at the hospital with her. And so that’s the day I had gotten back from touring, and so I was kind of tired. I said, can I make it tomorrow? And she said, Yes. And tomorrow comes and my aunt calls and says, your sister’s gone.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  49:52

Oh God.

 

Patti LaBelle  49:53

So I didn’t get a chance. That’s not good.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  50:01

No, but you’ve forgiven yourself for that. And she knows that you love her, doesn’t she, Patti.

 

Patti LaBelle  50:08

Tissue, yes, she knew it, yeah, she knew it, yeah, yeah, but you just think about things you didn’t do.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  50:17

Right, but isn’t that always the case? When you lose people you love?

 

Patti LaBelle  50:20

There are things that you know you could have done.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  50:23

Yeah, of course, believe me and I say the same thing. Believe me with my own sister, but at the end of the day, you were.

 

Patti LaBelle  50:33

At the end of the day, I I realized that she was my love. Yes, I’m sorry. For crying. No,

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  50:44

That’s okay. I’m sorry. I didn’t mean to make you cry.

 

Patti LaBelle  50:47

No, it’s just the way it is.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  50:51

And now you feel, I believe, I hope, that you have peace about it, about that.

 

Patti LaBelle  50:58

Yeah, I it’s hard to talk about when I think I can talk about it, then I realize I really can’t.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  51:06

Yeah, it catches you. It’s like a It’s like being a hit from behind or something. Yeah, I understand that. Yes. Um, well, Patty, is there something that you would go back and tell yourself at age 21.

 

Patti LaBelle  51:25

At age 21 I would have said to myself, don’t be so afraid. Don’t be so shy. Don’t be so scared. Not scared, but scared. Don’t be so scared. Just know that your life is going to turn out all right, you know. And I have lived to see that.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  51:42

Yeah, you had.

 

Patti LaBelle  51:43

I’m all right. Yeah, you’re all right. Yes, baby.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  51:47

Is there something you would go back and say yes to?

 

Patti LaBelle  51:51

That’s a good question that I could think of, no.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  51:56

Really? You’ve said yes to everything you wanted to say yes.

 

Patti LaBelle  52:02

I wanted to say yes to.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  52:04

I love that.

 

Patti LaBelle  52:05

Because everything that I say yes to made me feel good, and it was age appropriate, yes.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  52:12

Is there something you’re looking forward to?

 

Patti LaBelle  52:14

More life.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  52:16

Yeah, I was gonna say graduating to 81.

 

Patti LaBelle  52:18

Graduating, my graduation 81.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  52:21

Your graduation in May, because you’re a Gemini, correct?

 

Patti LaBelle  52:24

May 24.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  52:25

Nice, is there something that you would like to tell me about aging, Patti?

 

Patti LaBelle  52:33

Just don’t be afraid of it. Don’t be afraid of turning whatever you’re going to turn to be older. Some people live to be nervous about turning certain ages. Don’t just accept it. You made it so don’t be afraid of life.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  52:49

Yeah, and that seems like a really lived thing for you, Patty. I mean, you are actually scared to turn certain ages, and you aren’t anymore. It’s good advice. Is there something you wish that you’d spent less time on? Patty, no, see, I think you’ve had the perfect life.

 

Patti LaBelle  53:09

I can’t say that I’ve had the perfect life. Julia, I can say that I’ve had a nice life and a life that I don’t regret.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  53:18

But I call that a perfect life, a nice life that you don’t regret. You know, not a lot of people can say that. Patti LaBelle.

 

Patti LaBelle  53:24

I know it a lot of you can say it, yeah, I can say it and mean it.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  53:29

Yeah, oh my god. It’s been such a delight to talk with you. You are just the most Oh, God, wonderful human being.

 

Patti LaBelle  53:38

I had a feeling that it would be like this with you and I, and I’m so pleased have spoken with you, and thank you so much, honey.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  53:58

Wow, what a life Patti LaBelle has lived. Okay, let’s get my mom on the Zoom. Can’t wait to talk to her about this conversation. Hi, Mommy, I have to turn your audio on.

 

Mommy  54:13

Yeah.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  54:14

What’s the problem?

 

Mommy  54:16

I’ve got Garrison Keillor on, and I can’t turn them off.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  54:19

On your phone where it’s coming from. Okay, so it’s just playing. You don’t know. Why do you want to just turn your phone off?

 

Mommy  54:26

Yeah.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  54:27

Garrison killer, once again, ruining the podcast.

 

Mommy  54:32

Okay, all gone.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  54:33

Nice.

 

Mommy  54:34

Hi, love.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  54:35

Hi, Mommy, so guess what? Today we talked to Patty LaBelle, the wonderful Patti LaBelle. And remember she had that big hit back in 1974 was called Lady Marmalade, but the tune was von le vu cuis. Do you remember that?

 

Mommy  54:54

Oh, I do remember that. You know, yes.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  54:58

I used to sing that all the time. But because it was so naughty, of course. And I thought I was like, you know, pushing the edge of the envelope.

 

Mommy  55:09

Let me worry. I mean, my God, you were.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  55:11

Yeah, I was,who will you sleep with me tonight? I mean, that was very dirty. Were there any dirty songs like, well, not like that. But what was considered dirty when you were growing up?

 

Mommy  55:23

Well, we used to do these, the exercises, you know, we’d go, we must, we must, we must increase our bust, the boys, the boys, the boys depend on us.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  55:39

I don’t think that was a top 40 hit.

 

Mommy  55:41

No, wouldn’t it didn’t make it, but it was a good hometown thing. It was good in Columbus, Ohio. It was made all the charts. I don’t think there were any. It was such a we were such a quiet generation. You know, I can’t think of a single song that was would bring a blush to anybody’s chic.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  56:10

When I was in high or in junior high. It was, we must increase our bust. The bigger, the better, the tighter the sweater the boys depend on us.

 

Mommy  56:20

That’s another one. Yes, that that that got very complicated once it got eased.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  56:29

Well, it’s such an unfortunate rhyme in every on every level, exactly, exactly I hope we haven’t brought it back into popularity by mentioning it on the show. I’m so sorry about that. We can I know I am too. I have huge regrets right out but back to Patti LaBelle, yes, she just turned 80 in this past year, and her son threw us through her surprise party with everybody she’s ever worked with in her entire life. Showed up to this party in New York, and it was a very, very big deal, but it reminds me of when mommy, remember when I had the surprise party and you told me about it. Do you remember?

 

Mommy  57:11

I know that made me feel so bad. I’m so sorry.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  57:13

Oh, I’m so sorry. I didn’t mean to bring it up to make you feel bad. It’s fine. It’s it’s a great family lore story.

 

Mommy  57:20

I know. How did I tell it? Did you slip out or did I?

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  57:24

Yeah, it just slipped out. You said, You we? I think, I think what was going to happen was Brad was going to take me away somewhere, if I’m remembering this correctly, and you and daddy had come to take care of the kids while we were going to go somewhere, and we were about to leave, and you said something like, well, see you in Santa Barbara later, like that, because that’s where the surprise party was.

 

Mommy  57:55

I know oh, dear. Did you pretend it was a surprise? Or did you just say I had ruined the whole thing? Or how’d you work that out? I can’t remember.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  58:04

Well, I mean, I knew something was going to happen, but I didn’t know what the extent of it was, so be there and everything. Yeah, exactly. I didn’t know what this, what it was going to unfold to be, so I was obviously surprised by that. And it was such a joyful occasion. It didn’t, it didn’t really matter at all. And this all reminds me very much of Patti LaBelle, in fact, because she’s somebody who’s gone through a lot, but she’s really, really happy in her life. She’s very at ease with who she is. So I think she was definitely happy to be celebrated as she should be, that thing of of having a party, celebrating your life and you like, and you get to sort of sit back and look at it, and assuming you’re happy, or relatively even, not even just happy, happy, just reasonably happy with where you are, that’s a lot to be celebrated, you know.

 

Mommy  58:55

Of course it is. It is, for sure, and then, and then to be singing. I mean, how wonderful, wonderful that she is still singing.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  59:02

I know it was an incredible honor to be able to talk to her, no doubt. All right, Mommy. Well, so long. Oh, there’s the front door. I have to go, Mommy. I’ve got the gate guys here to fix the gate.

 

Mommy  59:14

Oh, okay, good, well, I love you, and I’ll see you soon.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  59:18

Okay, I love you. Thank you for talking with us. So happy to be here, bye, Mommy.

 

Mommy  59:23

Love you.

 

Julia Louis-Dreyfus  59:24

Bye.

 

CREDITS  59:34

There’s more Wiser Than Me with Lemonada Premium on Apple, you can listen to every episode of season three ad free subscribers also get access to exclusive bonus interview excerpts from each episode. Subscribe now by clicking on the Wiser Than Me podcast logo in the Apple podcast app and then hitting the subscribe button. Make sure you’re following wiser than me on social media. We’re on Instagram, and Tiktok @wiserthanme and we’re on Facebook at Wiser Than Me Podcast. Wiser Than Me is a production of Lemonada Media. Created and hosted by me Julia Louie Dreyfus. This show is produced by Kryssy Pease, Jamela Zarha Williams, Alex McOwen, and Hoja Lopez. Brad Hall is a consulting producer, Rachel Neil is VP of new content and our SVP of weekly content and production is Steve Nelson. Executive Producers are Paula Kaplan, Stephanie Wittels Wachs, Jessica Cordova Kramer, and me. The show is mixed by Johnny Vince Evans with engineering help from James Sparber. And our music was written by Henry Hall, who you can also find on Spotify or wherever you listen to your music. Special thanks to Will Schlegel, and of course, my mother Judith Bowles. Follow Wiser Than Me wherever you get your podcasts. And if there’s a wise old lady in your life, listen up.