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From the NFL to the halls of the Capitol, there were a few too many close calls this past week. V digs into Buffalo Bills safety Damar Hamlin’s recovery and the hard knocks that Republicans served to their barely elected speaker Kevin McCarthy. Plus, they’ll get into the nuances of the FDA’s new ruling on pharmacies and abortion pills. Then, they continue the conversation on bodily autonomy with Lizz Winstead, creator of Abortion Access Front and co-founder of The Daily Show, about how comedy can be used to expose anti-choice hypocrisy and rally behind reproductive rights.

Follow Lizz at @lizzwinstead on Twitter, Instagram, and TikTok, and find out how to get involved in the fight for reproductive justice by following Abortion Access Front at @abortionfront on Twitter and Instagram and @abortionaccessfront on TikTok.

Keep up with V on TikTok at @underthedesknews and on Twitter at @VitusSpehar. And stay up to date with us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at @LemonadaMedia.

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SPEAKERS

V Spehar, Lizz Winstead

V Spehar  00:01

Hey friends, it’s Tuesday, January 10 2023. Welcome to V INTERESTING, where we break down the viral and very interesting news you might have missed. I’m V Spehar and today, quick call up Vanity Fair, someone get a lie detector on George Santos. This newly elected rep has been falling flat on his face as people poke holes in his story. And he’s not the only one in a position of power not doing so hot right now. Plus, we’ll walk through all the nuances of the new FDA ruling for pharmacies and abortion pills. And we’ll get to continue the conversation with the brilliant Lizz Winstead the creator of abortion access front and co-founder of The Daily Show. All that more on today’s be interesting from Lemonada Media. Let’s be smart together. Big win for the Bills this past Sunday and not just on the field. Although anyone who watched that pats bills game can attest it was a monster. I mean, the first play of the game is a 96 yard return for touchdown by Bill’s running back. Hines who would do it again in the second half with a 101 yard return for a touchdown. Now there were fears that the Bills would be coming back timid or still shook from the experience of watching their teammate Damar Hamlin literally have his heartbeat restored during the Bengals game. But instead, what we saw on that field was love of the game, focus drive, and maybe even a little showing off for Damar who was watching? Yes, Damar Hamlin is awake, he’s breathing on his own. He’s communicating. He was even tweeting. There are these little moments in our lives that show us that there’s good in the world. And this was certainly one of them. It was a miracle. Everyone, it seems spent last week praying for Damar and keeping him in their thoughts. Just last week, his charity received $9 million in donations. fanzone the official retailer of the NFL announced all proceeds from Damar Hamlin merch would be donated to his charity, and every team made their profile picture praying for Damar and fans are calling for trainer Danny Kellington and the rest of the Beatles training staff to be enshrined in Canton, Ohio. For their lifesaving actions in Cincinnati. They performed CPR for nine minutes, which is an act of endurance that almost cannot be explained. It was an act of determination and love.

V Spehar  02:40

We got very lucky, football is a dangerous sport, and it’s also big business. The NFL talks a lot about making the game safer for players but the league is no stranger to making bad calls about player’s health. For decades, the NFL denied the link between concussions and traumatic brain injuries. This is best exemplified in the NFL is resistance to pay injury claims related to incidence of dementia or Alzheimer’s experienced by the players. The NFL was eventually held accountable by the courts and forced to pay workplace injury claims. But in some cases, they were paying their black players less than their white players. In June of 2021, they pledged to stop using race norming and dementia tests for retired players. Race norming is a set of standards developed in the 1990s originally to categorize dementia patients, which the NFL then use to justify not paying black players who suffered concussions, the same disability payments as their white peers. It basically assumed that black players started out with lower cognitive function than White players. They paid less arguing that Black players had less mental capacity to lose than White players. More than 2000 NFL retirees have filed dementia claims, but fewer than 600 have received awards according to the most recent report. More than half of all NFL retirees are Black. According to lawyers involved in the litigation. When Damar got hurt, lots of people felt like once again, the system that was supposed to protect players had failed, and maybe it did. So while we all got a sigh of relief when tomorrow woke up to hold his mother’s hand. And when those doctors reported that he was neurologically intact, we have to stay on the NFL to commit to better safety practices and ensure nothing like this can ever happen again. And if God forbid it does happen, that player compensation benefits for damages are treated equally. This past week, people have been rallying against another big terrible force. George Santos. I mean, Jesus Christ on a Ferris wheel people Is this guy a cartoon villain is anything he says true. In case you hadn’t heard. The newly elected Republican Representative from New York has been owning up to a real messy history. publications like The New York Times looked into claims he made ate on the campaign trail and found that many of them just weren’t true.

V Spehar  05:04

Here are just some of the things he since admitted to lying about working for Citi Group, working for Goldman Sachs, graduating from college, being Jewish, having grandparents who survived the Holocaust. I mean, any one of those is a major lie. And he maintained that all of them were true. He also recently admitted to using stolen checks when he was in Brazil years ago. And federal authorities originally did go after him for it, at least for a little while. Here’s a wild line from CNN, quote, police had suspended an investigation into Santos because they were unable to find him for nearly a decade. And then he got elected to the federal government from New York’s Third District. How did this happen? Some local reporters have said it’s partly because local outlets don’t have the resources or attention they need to report on things like this. There was hardly any small scale investigation to hold him accountable from the start. His own voters didn’t know the truth when they went in those ballot boxes. And a lot of them say that they are feeling betrayed. I mean, it’s spooky that an elected official got this far. Since most of the major stories of fraud and theft are often about people who are trying to ascend in business or social circles. I mean, do you guys remember that guy who pretended to be a Rockefeller, he even changed his name to like Clark Rockefeller to be more convincing. And he had been partying out in the Hamptons with the ultra-wealthy for years, only for it to turn out that he had no relation to the Rockefellers. Or think about like Anna Delphi, or the tinder swindler. We hear these things a lot. But this level of lying is wild, unprecedented and unthinkable for a government rep. And yet, analysts say it is likely that he’s going to keep his seat. So cam, the voters of New York moved to recall Santos. Now, it turns out in New York, there is no provision for a state or local government to stage a recall, an elected official is automatically kicked out of office if they’re convicted of a felony, and they may be removed if they’re convicted of a lower level crime. But for right now, technically, the only crime Santos is guilty of is being a big ol Pinocchio, which is a big ol bummer. If you could do all that right and face hardly any consequences. Will bad people ever stop doing bad things? And it begs the question, why not go a little further? Right? Like why not change your name to George Santa and just start claiming you complete billions of deliveries in a single workday.

V Spehar  07:35

I know it can feel like our government is broken and nothing is working and everything is a mess. The Speaker, the House votes were a disaster. I mean, Congress hasn’t taken this long to verify at the position since 1923. But even with all those shenanigans, there’s a lot that’s gotten done in government over the past few years, months and weeks, and Joey B. has been taking some time to acknowledge it. President Biden grabbed his signature aviators and took a victory lap to celebrate the launch of what he calls a once in a generation investment, the bipartisan infrastructure law that will fund 2800 bridge repair and replacement projects across the country. It awards funds to over 5000 new clean transit and school bus projects. approved state plans for water funding, Evie charging networks and high speed internet deployment among other incredible projects. Give a listen to our November 15 episode to hear Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg talk more about the legislation. The first stop on Biden’s victory tour was to the Brent Spence bridge in Northern Kentucky, which just got $1.6 billion to fund much needed repairs and build an entirely new bridge nearby. The Brent Spence bridge currently shoulders the weight of two interstate highways going between Kentucky and Ohio. The renovation plan is to limit that bridge to local traffic and build a whole new bridge that is meant only for highway traffic. Locals are sure to love that and Republican Governor Mike DeWine and Republican Senator Mitch McConnell were there to show bipartisanship and gratitude to President Biden for making this happen. Biden also recently welcomed President Zelenskyy to the White House. It was Alinsky his first known visit outside Ukraine since Russia invaded the country shortly after Congress passed the most recent federal spending package, which includes billions of dollars in additional aid for Ukraine. And just this Sunday, Biden took his first trip as President to the border. He walked a portion of the wall between Mexico and the United States with border agents, a group he’s been trying to build a better relationship with and announced his administration would tighten immigration enforcement by blocking Cuban Haitian and Nicaraguan migrants at the border expanding on the nationalities of those who can be expelled back to Mexico. Until now, Republicans had accused Biden of having a lack of focus on border security and attacks hard to tell exactly what policies would satisfy anti-immigration members of Congress or Republican governors of border states. Biden sent Congress an immigration reform plan on his first day in office over two years ago. But Republicans blocked his request for $3.5 billion to beef up border enforcement. I mean, do you guys want to fund the police or not? Right? Well, we’ll be sure to keep an eye on this issue over the next few weeks when a Republican controlled House is supposed to be proposing their ideas for border security. Here’s another thing the federal government’s been up to in recent days, a new ruling from the FDA that says pharmacies can now sell an abortion medication that’s mostly been available only at clinics. If pharmacies comply, both the medicines necessary for a medical abortion could be obtained at a place like CVS. As a person who’s never had an abortion myself, I did not know anything about medical abortion. So I went and found out and here’s the deal. A medical abortion consists of two pills, one you usually get at a doctor’s office and the second you were always able to scoop at a pharmacy.

V Spehar  08:47

And these two pills work together to help you terminate a pregnancy as comfortably as possible. So you take the one and then you take the other and you do need both for it to work. It’s never been an issue getting the second pill from a pharmacy since that one does a lot of different things. It’s not just for abortion. So for all those pharmacists, no, you could be in there trying to prevent stomach ulcers. It’s the first pill and the procedure that has been gate kept because it is abortion specific. So even though it’s been FDA approved for the last 22 years, until this announcement, patients have had to go in person to a doctor’s office to get it. And that’s a huge burden for lots of people because of time transportation and cost. The only other option for getting the prescription filled was to use a few select Mail Order pharmacies. The FDA hinted last month that they were going to move toward opening up access to both pills, and now that they’ve made the official change, more people should have quicker more local access to the medicine. Some requirements will be held over from a previous federal guideline, like requiring the prescribing doctor to be certified to treat abortion patients in the first place. But of course, Nothing Gold Can Stay Ponyboy. Now that SCOTUS has overturned Roe v Wade, individual states can still deny abortions and other reproductive care lawsuits are likely to come as a result of this change. And pharmacies have to complete a short certification before they can even start filling any of these prescriptions, which some might decide is it worth their time? So we really don’t know yet how this is going to play out state by state, like how many pharmacies will actually go through with the certification? Will it be a roadblock for patients that doctors will have to keep proving their credentials? Can an individual pharmacist refuse to hand over a prescript? Even if their location is certified to do it? Short answer, who the heck knows we live in the upside down, we could have a situation on our hands like the movie Plan B, where a pharmacist refuses to sell the morning after pill to a customer, based on what he says are moral grounds. And it sends two young people on this wild, scary, sad Chase across the state looking for somewhere else to get it. The creators of the movie said they wanted to bring this story to life because the situation is a reality for so many people in the United States. Even with all these caveats, though, there is some good news. 10s of 1000s of pharmacies in the US receive federal funding. And if they accept Medicare or Medicaid, they get federal money. It’s not all of them, but it’s a lot of them. And they are all prohibited from discriminating against patients under federal law. It protects patients from sex discrimination, which includes a subcategory of sex discrimination, pregnancy discrimination. So for once, there might not be a reason to be so pessimistic. There might even be a reason to smile. And smiling is good for us friends laughing is good for us. It is okay to laugh. It is okay to smile. We have to remind ourselves of that. And there are people whose whole job it is to make jokes about political happenings. It makes it all go down just a little bit easier. And it’s become the basis of shows like late night and the Colbert Report. And of course, The Daily Show, which was co-founded by today’s guest. Lizz Winstead is the woman in the room that makes that room one you want to be in her history and TV and writing goes back to when a baby Rachel Maddow was still sending out demo tapes. She co-created The Daily Show, and she is now using her comedic skill to debunk myths about abortion and spread the good word about reproductive rights. We’ll have some must see TV. Well, some must hear words in your ear. Right after the break.

V Spehar  15:02

Today we’re talking about reproductive justice. Some groups use facts, personal narratives or fear tactics to get their point across. But what about the people incorporating comedy into their work to educate and inspire change? Lizz Winstead is the co-creator of Comedy Central’s The Daily Show and founder of abortion access front, a team that uses humor to destigmatize abortion and expose anti-choice forces across the country. Liz, I am so happy you’re here.

Lizz Winstead  15:30

Thank you so much for having me. I love your pads. So I’m excited to be here.

V Spehar  15:34

It’s a safe, warm place. It’s a nice place.

Lizz Winstead  15:38

You know, I struggle being a woman in comedy, being a woman and a person who is fighting for reproductive rights, health and justice to find that warm, safe space available to me.

V Spehar  15:51

No, it’s definitely this podcast and physically under the desk. Those are the two safe places that I have established that you are always welcome in. And on that point, though, I mean, we’re gonna be talking about abortion. And this is funny now is this one of these things where like, we have to laugh, so we don’t cry? Like how bad is it? Liz? Are we like Bellevue hysterical laughing or like, we’re actually somehow able to find some humor in this world?

Lizz Winstead  16:16

I think we’re all of it. Right. And I think that thing is, for too long. We’ve seated all abortion narratives to the anti-abortion movement. And we’ve forgotten that there is a continuum of people’s abortion experiences, how they view them, everyone is different. And so how someone wants to bring their abortion stories to the forefront, is we need to hear all those stories because they’re all valid. And so for me, I love to infuse humor, when people want to bring humor to their circumstances. I also am a big fan of exposing hypocrisy when I can. And so the people who are coming forward with these horrifying abortion bans, or standing outside of clinics, or just bringing their just general garbage narrative, like I love dragging hypocrites for filth using humor. It’s sort of like once I realized I could, I was like, This is the greatest way to make a living on planet Earth. So I get to just say that bad guys are shitty, and pay my bills doing it. It’s kind of great.

V Spehar  17:25

It’s a win I know. Very popular on Tik Tok is the counter protesting of anti-choice people. And one of the things I’ve seen the kids do is do full ballroom voguing in front of the picket signs for the anti-choice people and just they really do sort of point out the absurdity. And the like, you’ve got to be kidding me about some of the aggressiveness of the anti-abortion people.

Lizz Winstead  17:52

Well, and I think a lot of times, you know, people who pay attention to the news in the world, you know, they’re familiar with Qanon, and these wild conspiracy theories and all this other stuff. And the anti-abortion movement has been promoting reproductive conspiracy theories for forever, you know, saying that abortion causes breast cancer or mental health crisis or sterility, or a whole host of other things that are simply not true. But if it goes unchallenged, and what we have mistakenly done for so long, is say, those are a few crackpots, we should ignore them. And that crack pottery, became mainstreamed. And that means streaming became people influencing politicians and some of the crackpots getting elected. And that’s turning into the laws, which sort of got us here. So to address your original question, is it Bellevue level hysteria or left? It’s all of it because the needle moves quickly, man, like, stay with me, because like, at some point, during the course of our conversation, 17 different laws can be passed that while we talk.

V Spehar  19:05

So how long have you been doing this activism? Because a lot of people know you from your career as a comedian, as a writer is the CO producer of The Daily Show, but when did you really say like, hey, women’s rights, abortion access, this is something I really care about. This is part of who I am, too.

Lizz Winstead  19:24

It has always been part of my wheelhouse. But to be honest, like in 1992, I told my abortion story on Comedy Central for the first time on a show called women allowed hosted by Mo Gaffney. And so I have been putting myself out there for a really long time because we hadn’t been talking about it and to be honest, within the course of me, doing the daily show, doing other political satirical things, when sis white males are in charge They, even when they’re progressive, they’re like, maybe we should lay off the abortion. Not everybody cares about it. It’s a wedge issue. And when people who are supposedly on your side, don’t understand that bodily autonomy is everyone’s fight, I realized that I wanted to go from just exposing hypocrisy and political satire in general. And I really wanted to focus on women and reproductive health rights and justice as a whole, because no one was doing it. And so I would say, I’ve been doing it for a long time. And I started my nonprofit back in 2012, when Wendy Davis was on the floor of the Texas State House, which maybe we all remember her filibustering in those sneakers. And I realized I was only seeing this online. The media wasn’t reporting it. It was a huge story in Texas. And I did some research and called up some friends who worked within the field and said, Why isn’t anyone covering this? And they said, This is our frustration. And then they said something to me, that was what really turned me around forever. They said, Liz, the dirty secret is, you’re watching Wendy Davis in Texas right now. And 26 other States dropped this identical piece of legislation. And, and they don’t have a Wendy Davis. So right now, as this is passing, and this is going through, we have the potential of half of our nation, taking up the same kind of bills, and the erosion started happening then. And I just felt like, I’ve seen how successful I couldn’t be with The Daily Show, talking about issues. And so I thought, I’m gonna go for it, I’m gonna gather some friends together, comics, writers, musicians, and ask folks if they want to start touring the country. And not only doing comedy shows that raise awareness and raise money for providers, but also, through audience building, bringing up the providers on stage, bringing up the local activists on stage, and creating a variety show where the audience could hear what was going on locally, and then be able to sign up right in the room, to be able to do something about it. And so what started out as a small band of funny, talented activists has now just this year when Roe v Wade fell, we have trained up 15,000 people to work in their own communities. And it’s pretty cool.

V Spehar  22:48

I gotta tell you, as a member of the accused radical left wing, TikTok media, I have a hard time sometimes because like, as a lifelong queer, I have never had an abortion, I will get called a baby killer when I put out like, I think women should have bodily autonomy, I think all people should have bodily autonomy. And that is hard, because you’re like, I am involved in this. I’ve never directly experienced it myself. But it does affect me in my life. But I also don’t want to get called names. It’s scary, and it’s upsetting and it and then you just feel like you’re defending yourself the whole time. And I know there’s a lot of folks who feel frustration out there because they’re like, Well, I’m not. I’m not for killing babies, but I am for, you know, people having privacy. And like, what do you say to those folks?

Lizz Winstead  23:39

So what I say to those folks is, are you willing to have a conversation with me about the language you’re using, A, no one’s for killing babies turns out universally most people who are saying aren’t for that. But I also say to is, there’s a process I go through all the time because I get called names a lot and so to you as a queer person. I’ve seen their value system, so their opinion is 100% irrelevant to put it in a way that Lizz Winstead speaks. If you’re not feeding me, fucking me or paying me, your opinion, will live at the bottom of my shoe. And so remembering that those without a moral center are the first ones to challenge yours. Because we’re good people where I come from, it’s from a good place where they come from is a place of trash. So it’s pretty hard to break me, but it does take some reminding. And once you can kind of get yourself into that mindset of why you do it, and that you’re good and that they are not coming from a place of good. You create an armor that not only can like repel their attacks, you can vove around it. It’s pretty comfortable. You can go anyplace any you can do yoga in it; you can jump around in it. It is not restrictive armor at all. It’s actually freeing armor, which is something that we often forget exists.

V Spehar  25:13

I grew up Catholic, as you did as we had a guest, Dr. Jennifer Lincoln, who is an abortion activist and gynecologist also grew up Catholic. And we’re all very staunch abortion activists, you know, but I’ve had thoughts like how many Hail Marys do I need to say like, I still have Catholic guilt sometimes around these things. But I also don’t recall the church ever being as up in our business, it was like ladies business back then. Right? It was women’s business. It was the priest in the politicians that didn’t want to be involved in that they didn’t, for wanting to legislate them. They don’t really know a lot about how women’s reproductive health works. And they didn’t really want to talk about it too much previously, how does your Catholic upbringing play into where you’re at now? There’s a lot of people who struggle with that.

Lizz Winstead  25:58

Yeah, well, I think the first thing to think about is the fact that abortion is mentioned nowhere in the Bible 00 times, I personally just have a problem with any foundational organization that never included someone like us, in its in its formulation, or never prioritize our joy, freedom or relationship with God in any way. So they have not ever cared about how we are. It has been, I mean, when you think about it, you know, priests could get married until the seventh century. And the only reason they created celibacy was because they wanted to inherit their estate, they didn’t want them to tie it to their family. That is why they stopped allowing priests to even get married. And so I believe that religion done well, helps you create your whole self, and helps you be your whole self. And if it’s prioritizing pregnancy, or something else, it’s not prioritizing you, if you believe God has given you tools with which you can kind of find things and do things and self-discover that God also gave you tools to make the best decisions you can to be the best servant of that God. And that means giving you options to say, if I’m a parent, and I can’t parent any more children, then I’m going to have an abortion. Or if I’m not someone who wants to parent at all, and I want to do other things with this life I was given on this earth and thrive, then I have the options to do so.

V Spehar  27:41

I remember the first time that I took one of my friends in high school to Planned Parenthood to find out if she was pregnant. And then she was and then was able to schedule with the providers there. An abortion it was very early. And I remember praying with her in the car. This was a very godly ask at the time, it was something that we were talking to Jesus about, like needing help through this, this thing that was happening that was so overwhelming. And people just don’t talk about that part enough. There have been other friends of mine who have had miscarriages, and I’ve been on the phone with them. And they’re talking to different gods about like, either Why did this happen to me, or give me the strength to get through this, which is why I agree, I think it’s terrible when religion gets weaponized and others people and it’s telling them, you’re actually not a part of this spiritual connection, there is no higher power looking down to help you and give you strength in your in your hardest, most difficult decision. And so, if people are listening to this right now, I hope you know that if religion is something that brings you strength, it should like it’s not it’s not something that we need to be excluding when we are practicing care for others and even activism.

Lizz Winstead  28:49

And it’s also, you know, different religions have very different interpretations of pregnancy, birth, when life begins, you know, when pregnancy begins, is science, when life begins is this whole theoretical thing that’s debated throughout the years? So, you know, it’s a lot, it’s a lot to take in. And there’s a lot of very emotional relationships around pregnancy, but I always say, which can be controversial that the pregnant person is the one who gets to define that pregnancy. And for someone who is pregnant and may struggle with abortion, but may need one No, it’s the right decision. It’s a very different place to be than somebody who got pregnant, doesn’t want to be got the appointment moves on to somebody who has a very wanted pregnancy, and something goes horribly wrong. And they have to have an abortion. You know, there’s so many stories that people bring and I’m just a fan of honoring all of them and allowing your pregnancy to be your own.

V Spehar  29:59

and that was largely the way we were looking at it for the last 50 years and then on a very sunny Friday while I was in LA surrounded by 10,000 Young people who love Tik Tok at the conference, VidCon, Roe v Wade was overturned, I made my tic tock and I faced 1000s of young people who were like, holy shit, VI, what do we do? And we’re scared, and we’re sad. And we’re male and female and non-binary, and every other thing. Everyone was collectively frozen in this; I cannot believe this moment. I want to know, where were you on that morning in June?

Lizz Winstead  30:39

Well, the morning in June, I was in New York City. And I think that, for me, the day the leak came out in May, when we saw the leaked decision. That was more of a gut punch to me, although I was in DC, when they argued the case. And we had seen this coming for a while. And the thing that scared me the most and scares me the most is exactly what you just said, you’re with 10,000 people who are terrified and didn’t know what to do. And for me that says, it has us reevaluate what is our movement, right? We have abortion practitioners, we have people who are doing everything in their power to fund people to get the care they need, get drive, people house them to get the care they need. But we don’t have a movement, where’s the movement to help people fight the laws, more than just marching? Right. And so when we heard the Supreme Court was going to take that case, out of Mississippi that overturned Roe v. Wade, way back nearly a year ago, we decided that we wanted to start something that could activate people when the time came, because we knew it was a win, not an F. So in June, when it happened, we were ready to go. And we launched a program called Operation Safe abortion. A month after the whole thing went down. We did an afternoon long training session that streamed online, it was like this really beautiful talk show where we brought in leaders from all different kinds of abortion activism. So whether it was the reproductive justice movement, where Black leaders from all around the country came forward and talk about how to center Black and Brown people and queer people and the people who are most marginalized with this, and how to work around the language you use, and who we support and who we sent her. Then we had a whole panel discussion on direct action, what we should do how we do more than just take to the streets, but hold politicians accountable, how we raise awareness about corporations who are funding, erroneous activities, and doing that, we had a whole session on abortion funding, how you can help abortion funds, practical support funds, and then legislative advocacy. And we had 10,000 People stream on one day, and then we vetted them. And then we are slowly introducing them into their local community organizations, as they have the capacity to take them in. And they’re able to really do the work locally. We also have an activist calendar on our website that if you want to just like train to be an abortion doula, or learn about the abortion pill, or do things locally, or on a national level, you can just go to that activist calendar, sign up for the event. And you can learn to how to do things in a myriad of ways. So for us, it was crucial that people understand that there’s a place you can go. And if you have 10 minutes to give a week, or an hour a month, that we can find a spot for you to make you feel like you are making a difference because not only do I want to activate people, I want to activate them where they are. We’re all living with a myriad of things that are hard, harms that we’re facing every day just to get by. And it’s not just about donating money. It’s really about getting some skin in the game to say, I recognize I’m part of a larger group of people whose lives are terrible. And can I help that in some way? And you know what? Writing some postcards to patients and clinics, if that’s all you have capacity for, the joy that brings somebody who’s alone is insurmountable. And it doesn’t seem like a lot but it’s huge. And that’s the big warm blanket that at abortion access front. We’re trying to do all the time for folks so nobody ever has to feel like they’re alone.

V Spehar  35:01

We’re gonna take a quick break. When we get back we’re going to hear more about abortion access front and operation safe abortion and how you can get involved directly. Okay, Welcome back friends. So just before the break, we were talking with Lizz Winstead about her nonprofit abortion access fund, and how you can get involved now I was reading on your website, it’s part USO, part of Habitat for Humanity. But abortion access, you describe it as a coven of hilarious badass feminists who use humor and pop culture to expose the haters fighting against reproductive rights. Just that sounds like fun. I mean, that sounds like fun.

Lizz Winstead  35:52

It is fun. And, you know, one of the things that I wanted to make sure when I decided I wanted to come into this space, I didn’t want to replicate the work of people who had been doing it for a long time. And I wanted to actually amplify that work. And so being a stand-up comic, having connections to all these great comedy, friends, being somebody who does political satire, it was like, what happens if we do this sort of USO, the USO pieces kind of traveling around the country, doing shows in these communities that are usually don’t get a lot of like, you went to Oklahoma City and Birmingham, Alabama, Little Rock, Arkansas, Tulsa, you know, we’re not going to like partland.

V Spehar  36:36

Like, there, okay. They’re talking about it already.

Lizz Winstead  36:41

But when you can gather three or 400 people who are like minded in a room, a, you all of a sudden look around and go, Hey, that’s Nancy, who lives across the street for me, or that’s, you know, Bob, and so and so from my work, and then you see that you are not alone. And then when we get to these towns, we stay three or four days, because it’s important to, for us to get to know, and to be able to have time to do a bunch of different things. Really get to know the activists on the ground and what they’re going through and what their needs are, how can we help grow the community for you? What you don’t know, or you might not know is, if you’re providing care in a hostile community, you can’t get someone to mow your lawn. You can’t get someone to repair your fence, because you provide abortion. So when we go to each town, we have a list of needs that the clinic has, can you replant our garden? Can you paint our exam rooms, and we will do those things. And then we bring their needs to our audience. So we say, hey, we just came down, we repainted the exam rooms, we did this and that and the other thing, but is there anybody in the audience tonight, who has a landscaping company, who has a plumbing company, who can fix their steps, because activism also means taking on a new client, the clinic, parking your van in front of that clinic, and saying, I provide my services to them, because I’m happy they’re in my community. And those things matter. So we connect people with safe people who want to do the work for them that they can trust. And so that part of it has been super rewarding. And then we had a weird, happy accident happened where when we started touring, one of the things that we needed to be super mindful of is security. Because when you bring in an abortion provider into a public space, it’s a risk to their life. So we did research into the anti-abortion extremists that were local. And then we also talked to the clinic escorts and the activists who have a lot of intel about these people who are outside the clinic every day. And nobody was collecting names and information. In all these cities we were going to so we started a database of anti-abortion extremists. And we were cross referencing them with photos and video. And we started a community of all of the people that we had met along the way. And we’re all sharing this information. And we have formed the largest anti-abortion database in the country. And in that we busted 30 people on January 6th, because we were watching their Facebook feeds to see that they were going turn them over to the FBI, and then just last October, because we sneakily start secret Facebook accounts and join their churches and monitor their behavior. We were able to download their rhetoric from their churches, and then videotape them in, like they Facebook Live themselves priming, breaking the law at the clinics. So we collected all of this, and we got 11 protesters are brought up on federal charges for harassing patients and clinics. And they will go to trial early this year. And hopefully, they will serve up to 10 years in prison and pay hundreds of 1000s of dollars in fines. So that’s the other thing that we had no idea we were gonna start all of a sudden, like, literally catching bad guys. But we’re also catching bad guys and holding them accountable in our justice system, which feels excellent.

V Spehar  40:45

That’s incredible, Liz, I’m like floored, and I’m typically on the floor. So this is like very floored, this is extra floored, I would have never even knowing that or thought of that like these things like you’re saying, even going back to what you were saying about these clinics can’t get somebody to do plumbing for them, because people are afraid that they’ll be targeted by these extremists. So you have to use all of society’s resources and tools and the social contracts we’ve made with each other to say, okay, but you are a good plumber, and you believe in the right to choice. So you do need to help these people out, and we’re gonna be there for you just the same. And well, these extremists are actually breaking federal laws, the government is actually not as against you, as you may feel like it is. Sometimes there are levers to hold people accountable. Because if you’re extreme on one thing, you’re probably extreme on several other things. It’s not like people get pinpoint extreme, they’re pretty broadly extreme.

Lizz Winstead  41:38

Oh, they’re intersectional in their hate, let me tell you, but v That’s exactly right, you just hit the nail on the head. And I didn’t know it either. I started out thinking, I’m just gonna go bring love and joy to these clinics, and bring communities together. But as we all know, once you get someplace, and you talk to people, new things arise and new things, you learn more, instead of just sort of theoretical learning. Once you’re down there with people and hearing their stories, it’s like, gosh, would it be helpful for you? If we had some massage chairs brought in one, you know, yes. And we never try to promise things that we can’t deliver. We’re always checking in with ourselves about like, what is our capacity? So that if we say, we’re going to do it, we do it. You know. And we tell that to everybody who’s like, how can I get involved? I’d like to help it’s like, well, first of all, the best thing to do is to say, what are you good at that you can do effortlessly. And then let’s plug that in, because then you’re weaving activism into your life. Rather than feeling like I have to go do this, and I have to make time for it. If you can weave it in it all of a sudden just becomes part of who you are. And then you’re also not only excited to do it, because you’re not overwhelmed. You’re also a great ambassador. For other people. It’s like, look at you with the busy schedule able to do this and that the other thing and still your skin looks great. And your hair looks amazing. How are you doing it? It’s like, because I don’t do too much. I say no, I take a breath for myself. And so those things are important.

V Spehar  43:31

So you said you go to these small towns, you know, is there a particular city that stands out to you as a place where you feel like you maybe had like the most impact or you saw the biggest surprises?

Lizz Winstead  43:43

You know, there’s little stories from each place. And I would say Tuscaloosa, Alabama, just really being able to facilitate a clinic that activist purchased. When we spent so much time there, we developed a trust. And they were able to express their vulnerabilities to us and have us support them and pick that up. But then there’s other things that were unexpected, and I’m gonna say a bigger city. But what we did in the city was really incredible. So in Detroit, there is a clinic that’s incredible. And the clinic is in a neighborhood that is in a very religious, African American neighborhood. And they really wanted their neighbors to get to know them and who they were. So there was a park near this clinic. And what we did was the clinic in the afternoon shut down all the clinic workers brought their kids and they put out flyers to the neighborhood that said, we’re getting a bouncy house. We’re gonna grill hamburgers and hot dogs. We’re gonna have a snow cone machine. And we have backpacks for 100 kids for back to school with the all the supplies and stuff for the kids come and get to know us, we provide abortion care. So we created this environment where people could come bring their kids, talk to the people who worked at the clinic, find out that they are like, really incredible community members. And we help them build a bridge. So we did all the legwork. We serve the hot dogs, we did all the stuff, which allowed all of the people that work at the clinic, to do all of the communicating with their neighbors, right. So I often say one of the things that we do, and something that’s really helpful as being the Pack Mule, in somebody else’s work, right. So when there is like organizations who are just tax, and they have a good idea, and they’re just tired, because they have to set up chairs, and they have to go buy the snacks, and they have to do if you can do all that stuff, so that the people with the good ideas can communicate with whom they need to communicate. It’s awesome. And so that’s really one big part of like, of what we did. And, you know, we had 100 families come. And they were able to just learn about this incredible resource in their community that also provided other things, birth control, STD testing, all this other stuff. And that was really, really next level, because it was, it was a little bit different than things that we do. But it was it was really great.

V Spehar  46:27

I think it’s always a surprise to people how family friendly a Planned Parenthood is or how family friendly pro Abortionists are, and how many of us actually have children and care about children and really want control of that ability to say what is best for a family, letting that responsibility lie with the family. And there’s so many guys, I think, when we talk about these we picture the Women’s March, we picture you know, feminists, as women, there are so many fellas that are right there alongside all of this, and they have a big place in this. They have a natural instinct to protect their fathers, their uncles, their brothers, their sons, who show up and should feel welcome in these spaces, too. And oftentimes do I actually have like a pretty big conservative male audience, which I’m so proud of, and I love them, we’re how can they kind of learn more like what is the place for men in all of this work? Right?

Lizz Winstead  47:23

Well, and you know, and I think that’s a really good question, because I think for a lot of years, we just told men, we didn’t need their voices, we didn’t need them to say anything we didn’t. Because part of that was for so long, men were speaking for women in every way, shape, or form. So it was just like, stop, shut up, stop speaking for us. As we’ve evolved, it’s like, learning how to listen. And to take the lead from women is important. And I’m saying this for myself. And for almost every sis heterosexual woman who has used birth control, right? It didn’t occur to me to ever ask any of my partners to split the cost of birth control, or to, like chip in for birth control. I always shoulder the cost. And men benefit from birth control and abortion profoundly. And if, like, I often say, if you’re not married to the first person who ever had sex with, you can thank birth control or abortion. It’s allowed all of us to pursue our paths and dreams. It’s allowed all of us to think about how we truly want to live our lives. And women have shouldered the cost of that and so like we do fundraisers, we’re doing we did one in New York, and we’re doing one in at the end of February called Bro v. Wade, I we’ve literally asked, just like straight white dudes who have had skin in the game, like, hey, do some comedy, raise some money for us? Because you know, and donate, donate the amount of money you think you saved on birth control to us, right? So it’s kind of like payback time, for all the times that you’ve just lived your life, gotten to where you needed to go, because you got to have the children you wanted to have them with, and all that stuff. And so it’s like a very fun tongue in cheek thing, but it’s really true.

V Spehar  49:30

Yeah, reproductive reparations. I’m here for it. I think that makes sense. And Jeff Ross is a big vocal supporter of this movement to comedian Jeff Ross. Incredible roastmaster I think the thing that happened with that day in June when Roe v Wade was overturned and I was getting spoken to by all of these young people, it was pretty equal, identifying as male identifying as female who had so many questions about this. And the boys were like, you mean just tell me that some like old ask congressman who got to do whatever he wanted his whole life is now going to tell me that hookup culture is over, that like being able to continue my life is over that me being able to make a choice with my partner about contraception or about abortion is over, or people being even because there’s families that do family TikTok’s, who also were up in arms, and they got like eight, nine kids, and they’re like, I literally could not have another child, my wife would die, she would not be able to endure this. And now you’re going to tell me, a person who has nine children and loves them, that suddenly now this is this option is going away? And men’s reaction matters.

Lizz Winstead  50:39

You know, it does matter, because we can’t fight this alone. Just like black folks can’t fight racial injustice alone. They didn’t start it, you know, like, White supremacy happened. You know, Black folks didn’t bring this on themselves. We have to right the wrongs of where that’s at. And so it’s important for men to speak up to say, historically, we’ve had a government that’s been run by men, that is run the lives of people who are not them, that has not taken them into circumstances. And no, it’s not cool. And it’s more than just abortion. bodily autonomy is someone’s humanity, it’s your first line of personal defense is controlling what happens in your skin. And honoring that. And defending that all of us from the core of our being is the place that we need to be to say no more. And so the United Front needs to be men, women, all genders, all races, you know, standing up and saying you cannot decide for someone else. What the circumstances of their life Shelby, we will not stand for it. We will not live in that America.

V Spehar  51:53

Now, a lot of folks know a lot about the things we’ve talked about. Those are pretty, you know, obvious topics that have been in the news, they’ve been on TV, they’re in comedy, they’re in movies, they’re everywhere, these issues. But something that I only just recently learned about is fake abortion clinics. And I now that I’ve watched enough TikTok to learn how to identify them. I know that there’s one right here in my town in Rochester, right, right near my house. And they are compelling, and very tricky. So can you tell folks, what is a fake abortion clinic?

Lizz Winstead  52:28

Yes, so there are clinics, and I’m air quoting, because they provide very little medical care, they will give pregnancy tests. They might test you for an STD, but they don’t really treat you, they don’t give condoms. They don’t provide abortion care or referrals. They don’t help you with really anything. They’re set up by extremists, Catholics and Christians who and they’re set up solely to talk people who are seeking abortion care, out of abortion, they will promise you diapers, they might promise you that they will help you sign up for government assistance. But, and this is the tricky part, their existence is sometimes siphoning off of the very programs that help single parents going into them. So what happens is they will call themselves oftentimes, the name of an a provider, that’s very near them, sometimes next door across the street, they use the same font, they’ll use the same like everything, and they’re right across the street. So you oftentimes, if you Google, it’ll say, pregnant need help seek our options. And you’ll go there. And they will take your phone, put a you in a gown, take your purse, and then they will an unlicensed person who runs an ultrasound machine will give you an ultrasound. And oftentimes they will say things like, oh, you’re fine, you’re, why don’t you come back and visit us in a month. And then we’ll talk about where you think you are at. And they’ll say you’re just 6 weeks along, when really you are 12 weeks along, and then another month, you’re not able to access the care that you need. Or conversely they’ll say you’re too far along. There’s nothing you can do about it. They’ll tell you abortion causes breast cancer; abortion causes all kinds of things that aren’t true. And then they’ll give you pamphlets about promiscuity, very judgmental, and they don’t really help you and they will not help any existing children you have. So when they say also like we have diapers and clothes and strollers, the way that you can actually get help from them is you have to earn time by volunteering there. So if you’re a person who doesn’t have means or time to volunteer, because you’re just trying to make ends meet, you can’t volunteer, and they won’t help you.

V Spehar  55:19

How is this legal? How is this? They have rent, right? They have to have a business license; you have to have filed for that? Isn’t it false advertising? Isn’t it entrapment?

Lizz Winstead  55:30

You’re gonna die when I tell you? So, first, I’m going to tell you that there’s about 500 clinics left in the United States that provide abortion care. And there is upwards of 4000 of these fake clinics just to give you a disparity, how they exist, we went to the Supreme Court, to say, you have to be transparent. And you shouldn’t be able to just say these things, the Supreme Court came back and said, if you are not providing actual medical care, you can dress up like a doctor all day long. You can operate an ultrasound machine, not as a doctor, you can give somebody false information. And it’s legal and covered under the First Amendment because you are not actually providing care, you can create a facade of providing care to the point where you literally dress up in a lab coat and pretend that you are a doctor. And it is legal in this country under the First Amendment. I am actually speechless. Yeah, yeah. If you want to read about the Supreme Court case, it’s called NIFLA, which is an acronym for […] V. Becerra, and you can read that Supreme Court case, and read why it is legal, and it is wholly upsetting. And to me, the level of disempowerment and shame and lack of investment in a person who comes to at their weakest moment and their most vulnerable to say, I’m seeking an abortion, I can’t afford, I can’t do this for a myriad of reasons. Sometimes it’s because it’s unsafe for them to be pregnant. I can’t tell you how many people that we help who, when they seek abortion care, one of the first things we have to ask is, is it safe for you to have a medication abortion at home, which is like having a miscarriage? And a lot of times, it’s like, no, the person that I’m with, it’s not safe, they can’t know. So we have to make sure that they can have an abortion in clinic, so that when they have their abortion, and they go home, they can have their privacy around that, you know, there’s so many tricky instances that you just, you can’t even imagine until you’re in it. And so that’s why I’m just like, the second somebody starts with the judgment. I’m like, you got to stop right there, you are wholly ill informed and making these wild generalizations about people’s circumstances, and about abortion as a whole. And like, I just want, I just want to be able to help someone with this problem they have, and to be able to do whatever they need to have done so they can get on with their life and how they need to.

V Spehar  58:46

Liz, we had rich Ferraro from GLAAD on a couple of weeks ago. And one thing that I loved about him is he was like, it’s our place to sort of educate the media on how to tell queer stories so that they get it right. What responsibility do you feel as a media expert to being that kind of trainer for folks that are out there to help them get the story right.

Lizz Winstead  59:09

Well, it’s like it’s two parts, right? It’s not only are we trainer, we also became the media. So one of the things we also did was we started a podcast so that we could tell the stories weekly of the news that’s coming out what you can do to help having the experts on the people who are providing the care, the activists, the researchers, you know, because those people you don’t see, the sad result of the media ignoring this trajectory towards the erosion of abortion rights is that they didn’t understand the trends. They didn’t understand who the experts were in the field, and they didn’t understand the language around abortion. They were using friendly media using talking points like phrases like partial birth abortion or when you, you know, abort your baby, you know, when you start or you say life of the mother, like, unless you know that person’s a parent, not everybody, like you are you are humanizing the pregnancy over the person pregnant every time. So it’s our goal to help educate the media to talk about it. But the tricky part is, they have such hubris that when they talk about it, they often will book like sort of generalist experts who read the same articles that we all read, who are not in the thick of it. And so for me, it’s like, anytime that we can beg them to have on these incredible clinic owners who are running independent clinics, in these hard hit areas have on these incredible researchers who are great interviews can tell you things you don’t know, I mean, the fact that you and I are talking right, and you, you know, a lot of chat, you know, you know a lot of shit. And when you’re like this is so you know, I’m learning so much more from you, Liz, like, that’s because I’ve gone deeper. So I can bring new information and also hopefully, compelling information, that regular folks who maybe are pro-choice or care about things or never thought about it, or maybe were judgey can hear a new way to think about what someone’s going through. But if you just have on sort of like cookie cutter experts, and you’re just sort of telling the story of what happened, you need to tell the story of who it’s happening to, and what the ramifications of what is happening are. And those are the pieces that are missed. And those are the things that I hope that all of you who are listening, and you want to hear more, it’s like, we have a very fun podcast, it’s called feminist buzz kills live, it’s every Friday. And it’s like the news of the week around abortion with like the scholars and the people providing the care that you never hear from. And it’s funny, and we read people a new one, and it’s great, but it’s important, and then we give you a call to action. Each week, we focus on some cool thing that’s going on that you can like, join in and participate in because unless we tell these stories, weekly, it remains novelty. And abortion stories were novelty for a really long time. And we would pull our hair out, begging them to and saying, hey, this is happening over and over again. These people who you call crackpots are getting elected to state legislatures, and they’re making inroads, and they’re getting legislation passed, you know, and now we see where we’re at, which is 40 million people of reproductive age, are living with very little or zero access to abortion in their state 40 million people. It’s wild.

V Spehar  1:03:00

Is this a failing of the establishment Democratic Party to this point that we know Republicans have been hard line and organized and you know, on brand since 1973.

Lizz Winstead  1:03:12

So on brand, I 100% believe it is because Democrats ran away from it, and thought that voting against draconian laws was enough. But until we reclaim the language and the storytelling and actually work to say the word abortion, talk about it, and put it back into its proper space of dignified health care that somebody might need to access in their lifetime, and talk about it as such, removing it means literally giving the government control over someone else, and swearing to never let that happen. Until we get to those conversations. It is a failing of the good people. And the good people is the Democratic establishment. Where have you been? You know, our President Joe Biden, he himself is personally doesn’t believe in abortion. So it’s very hard to have him advocate for it. When he’s trying to toe that line of knowing that it’s a right that people should have versus how he personally feels about it. The lack of really forward conversations and positive conversations can cause more harm than you think. The silence can cause more harm than you think.

V Spehar  1:04:33

There are so many people I’ve seen in the comments of the discourse of this topic who are like, Well, if you knew what it was like to lose a child, you would never be pro-abortion and I’m like that is your trauma speaking and that is a horrible thing, but somewhere along the lines that got mixed into this, and it’s like no, but it may it makes that second that other side so loud because the horror of losing a child is not exactly the same but the trauma of having abortion deserves its own time as well. We talked to a woman Alexus from Florida who was saying, folks are out here saying stuff like, oh, they’re using it for birth control, or people are getting abortions like 12 times a year. And they’re just out here doing this all the time. And she was like, it is a thoughtful moment. Hers was kind of painful. And, but it was something that she wouldn’t change. It was something that she did, and she stands by, but we lose empathy for people who have abortion, who have a hard time with it, because the rhetoric has been, well, it’s all these loose women out here, just acting crazy and using abortion as birth control and like.

Lizz Winstead  1:05:33

I’m gonna throw a monkey wrench into some things here. And what if someone was using abortion for birth control? And those are the things that we don’t sort of think about enough, right? Because the second we decide, there’s a certain number of abortions that are okay, that there are certain kinds of abortions that are okay. You know, oh, okay, I’m fine with them for rape and incest. What that does is, it makes it so that there’s good abortions and bad abortions, right. And for me, I don’t ever want to be in a position where I judge someone for why they’re choosing their abortions. And the other thing I will say to folks also is, and I’ve had people say this to me, which is, you know, no one’s ever come to me to talk to me about their abortion, so I, you know, and it’s like, it could be because of how you talk about it. Like, if you want to be the person in someone’s life, that they can come and talk to you. That means that they’re listening to how you’re talking about it. And if you say like, no one’s pro-abortion, well, someone who’s had an abortion is, is darn glad they got to have that abortion. And so, you know, think about how you hold space for people. Think about how you’ve maybe thought about it, or how you’ve judged? Or have you put caveats on it. And just a little bit of a reexamination of how you talk about it, so that the everyone in your life who would ever have an abortion could look to you as that soft place to land, just be that soft place to land and understand what that means. How have audiences

V Spehar  1:07:21

generally reacted to your content to the podcast to the tour,

Lizz Winstead  1:07:27

it’s sort of like you when you’re like, Oh, my God, I’m learning so much. I think people feel like, they’re excited, somebody else opened the conversation, and started talking about abortion. They heard about things in a new way. People who’ve had abortions feel incredibly grateful that there is dialogue, without like, making them feel judged. The podcast, people have been so thankful to be able to hear that there is something that they can do actually hear that this is a thing that’s happening all the time. It’s not just, you would think that abort like anti-abortion extremists pop up here and there, the way the media tells it. So for them to be able to listen to the quick hits of the stories. Here’s some deep dives into the stories of people who have been through a lot and then hear what the call to action is. They’re just really grateful that they can listen, learn and participate. And the audiences are so thankful that they can have a complex fun evening, right? So you can laugh your ass off. Love the music. Here’s some incredible stories here about what’s happening, get some information, sign up to do something. It’s like, wow, it is a night of like, a lot of stuff. And they feel really good about that. How do

V Spehar  1:09:01

you make abortion funny, though, I need to know like you have to tell us like one of the jokes or something.

Lizz Winstead  1:09:10

Right. So I think that what folks need to know is sometimes there’s jokes about abortion, but sometimes it’s just people doing their acts who are comedians and the comedy and the music is the vehicle with which we get people to gather so I talk about my abortions I’ve had more than one abortion so I say for example joke I have matches, where I say I chose not to have kids a couple of times.

V Spehar  1:09:39

Okay, there it is.

Lizz Winstead  1:09:42

You know, and then like I I’ve often like I get attacked a lot online. And I remember I remember one guy saying well, how many abortions Have you had, and like, Oh, you’re gonna come at me. I’ll come back at you with snark and I said, I don’t know I don’t say receipts. So like that like right throws the I’m off, they don’t expect it. That’s like moving on next. Because the truth be told, when people say horrible things to harm you. They want to know that they’ve harmed you. If it doesn’t work, they move on. So if you can just come back in and attack with some wholly disarming thing that’s like, whatever, or I’ll say are you flirting with me?

V Spehar  1:10:27

I feel like you trying to make it 12.

Lizz Winstead  1:10:33

It’s that kind of thing where it’s like, I’m just, I’m too old. And I’m too committed to just opening as much space as I can. For people who have never had anybody. Try to get them on a path. You know, I’ll never forget, I was doing a fundraiser at a clinic. And the doctor said to me, Liz, this is so important. And I just want you to know that, like, you speaking in a show, that defends the work that I do, helps me with my own joy. And it’s crucial for me as a provider to have joy, because a lot of times my patients, from the time they find out they’re pregnant, till the time they get to my office, no one has ever been kind to them. So when I can be that person, and have the strength to be that person, those that get me there are crucial. So be a person that brings kindness into somebody’s life. So that on the journey, they’re hitting those people along the way,

V Spehar  1:11:49

Liz, tell folks where they can find you where they can sign up for the training that you do.

Lizz Winstead  1:11:56

So if you wanted to keep abreast of what’s happening in a fun smart way, please subscribe to our podcast feminist buzz kills live, it’s everywhere you listen to your pod. If you want to get involved in the training, watch the series, I highly recommend gather a bunch of friends and like do like a once a week, maybe once every other week, listening because we have a workbook that goes with each of the episodes. It’s called OperationSaveAbortion.com And it’s there. There’s also the activist calendars, there’s a tool kits there the whole thing. And if you wanted to general volunteering, join us get ideas of ways that you can be helpful with the people in your community. Sign up to volunteer at aaafront.org, volunteer and also look at our adoptive clinic program, which is all of the clinics from around the country and the activists who are helping them out have wish lists of like we need hand warmers when we have patients go in we need like tea and coffee. We need a heating pad covers for our patients we need new artwork that’s adopted clinic that’s right on our website as a front end you can also donate always gonna take your cash because we like cash.

V Spehar  1:13:11

Liz thank you so much for spending this time with me it has been so overwhelmingly educational and fun and I’m so grateful to have got to meet you.

Lizz Winstead  1:13:22

You have the best guests on so when they literally said you’re gonna go on V, I was like that’s not even real. I’m so excited and thankful and thank you for just being open and hearing and allowing me to just talk about a topic that’s really hard because I know you’re gonna get a lot of a lot of people coming at you for it. And so I appreciate I really appreciate it.

V Spehar  1:13:46

We’re gonna have a lot of people protecting us too. I know we will. So I appreciate you Liz. Find her follow her do the training help your neighbors paint and abortion clinics exam room. Have a good time. Holy smokes folks. What an incredible magic unicorn of a human Lizz Winstead is, I learned so much. And like she said, I tend to kind of like no, a lot. I mean, we’ve done three or four episodes now on reproductive rights. And I had never thought about advocacy as planting flowers, right as flipping burgers at a community event. Advocacy is so much more than protesting petitions and marching. I’m inspired and I hope that you are too, be sure to tune into next week’s episode where we’re going to dig into the headlines you might have missed. And we’re going to have Melissa Urban, the founder of Whole 30 here to talk about improving diet culture, even revealing some of her own concerns with the industry and what she learned from her divorce. She’s also going to teach us how to set better boundaries and manifest lucky girl vibes for 2023 leave me a voicemail. I love to hear from you guys. 612-293-8550. Follow me at @underthedesknews on TikTok, Instagram and YouTube, and guess what pals, there’s more be interesting with Lemonada Premium subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content, like Lizz Winstead telling us what you watches on TikTok and what gets you excited about news, comedy and politics. Subscribe now in Apple podcasts.

CREDITS  1:15:20

V INTERESTING is a Lemonada Media Original. Our producers are Rachel Neel, Xorje Olivares, Martín Macías, Jr. And Dani Matias. Executive Producers are Stephanie Wittels Wachs and Jessica Cordova Kramer. Mixing and Scoring is by Brian Castillo, Johnny Evans and Ivan Kuraev. music is by Seth Applebaum. Please help others find the show by rating and reviewing wherever you listen and follow us across all social platforms at @VitusSpehar and @UnderTheDeskNews, also, @LemonadaMedia. If you want more be interesting, subscribe to Lemonada premium only on Apple podcasts.