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For the first time ever, Ricki tells her hair loss story in detail alongside her friend and mentor Y, the founder of The Women’s Hair Loss Project. After Ricki began losing her hair in 1995, Y helped her explore treatment options, shop for wigs, and deal with the emotional turmoil. Y and Ricki swap stories of what it felt like to shave their heads, discuss drugs they took that didn’t work, and talk about how they finally came to a place of acceptance.

Learn more about the Women’s Hair Loss Project: https://www.womenshairlossproject.com/.

Follow Y @whlpnetwork.

Follow Yomarie Castellano, aka Hair Loss Bonita, @hairlossbonita.

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Transcript

SPEAKERS

Ricki Lake, Y, Old Recording

Ricki Lake  00:02

This is The High Life with me, Ricki Lake, where we get to find out how my guests crack the code to living a full and vibrant life, so you can too. It’s an understatement to say, I’m so excited for today’s episode. This is a subject that I care so much about, as most of you probably know, I started struggling with hair loss, gosh, in my mid 20s, and it has been a journey. It was like my private secret for a very, very long time, and it was only just almost five years ago that I made the very scary decision to shave my head and to go public with what I’d been suffering with for so long. It was one of the scariest and most empowering things I’ve ever done in my life. And the person, one of the people that I have to credit for getting to that place of of courage and badassery, is my guest today, Y. Yis the founder of the women’s hair loss project, which is an incredible resource for women experiencing hair loss. She has videos and articles and tons of information. She explains the different kinds of hair loss that you can suffer from. It is 100% a labor of love, which is a testament to what a big heart she has now. Y has requested to be anonymous during this interview, as she is on her website to protect her privacy, given how vulnerable her work is, I cannot say enough about how amazing this woman is and what an inspiration she is. Y, thank you so much for coming on my podcast.

 

Y  01:26

Oh my god. Thank you so much for having me be here. I am so excited to be here. I love you so much.

 

Ricki Lake  01:32

I feel the same way. Okay, we always start this podcast with one question, where are you getting your highs from right now? What is bringing you joy?

 

Y  01:41

Okay, well, in the moment, my joy is being here with you. That’s definitely a high up to be on the high life. And I think also, you know, 17 months ago, I actually shaved my head, which was a very difficult thing for me to do, and it’s been a journey since that time, and as I’ve evolved in this process, believe it or not, I’ve been able to accept more along the way. So a high in my life is actually accepting my new reality, which was different than my previous reality. So learning to accept this new version of me, learning to love this new version of me, has been a high in my life. I thought about that. It was like, what would be a high? That’s a high. It’s a high to look at yourself in the mirror in a completely different way and say, I love you, I accept you, and you know, this is okay. That is a high.

 

Ricki Lake  02:34

Wow, yeah, I have to say being coming to a place of peace and self acceptance and self love. That’s definitely part of my story when I chose to shave my head. So let’s go back. What was your issue with your hair in the beginning? When did it start falling out?

 

Y  02:49

It started in 1999 when I was 21 years old and just one day to the next and I had no understanding of what was going on. I was born with enough hair for three people, so it was very obvious when it started falling out, because I never saw hair ever around me and never it wasn’t on a pillow. People say they lose 100 hairs a day. That was not my story, but it was everywhere. And I was scared. There were no resources in 1999 I mean, you were the this is the Internet where you have like the spinning E and there’s nowhere to go to there’s no one to talk to. And doctors were not helpful. They were very dismissive, because all they could see was hair on my head. So I felt very, very alone and frightened of what my future would look like if this could not stop. And I feared that it would not stop.

 

Ricki Lake  03:40

Did a doctor have an answer? Because you did kind of piece it all together and figure out what you believe caused the initial hair loss.

 

Y  03:48

Totally, so I, without a doubt, I know it was actually getting off the birth control pill, lowest or in FE was what kicked in my genetic predisposition for female pattern baldness, I had a genetic predisposition. And a lot of women don’t know, when you go on a pill or you come off a pill, you are messing with your hormones. And if you have a genetic predisposition for hair loss that may not have occurred for 40 more years or whatever, you could kick it in at 18, and in my case, at 21 so ultimately, I did find a doctor in New York who diagnosed me with female pattern baldness, and that was like the, you know, death blow to get at, you know, a year after my hair loss began. Because up until that time, I was really hoping, like, it would be just stress, like everybody said, you know, and all of this, but that’s a diagnosis that basically says your hair loss is progressive. It will be forever be progressive. Treatments are limited. So you’re like, looking down the barrel of what you’re you don’t know what your future will look like, you know?

 

Ricki Lake  04:47

So you’re 21 years of age, and obviously I would imagine, just like any other woman, you were very attached to your hair. What was that like? Emotionally? What kind of support did you have at that time.

 

Y  04:58

On fig I didn’t have a lot of. Support. I, you know, I tried to speak about it. I think it’s very hard for people to understand hair loss, especially if you if you have hair on your head still, and I had a ton of hair, because I was born with so much hair, so I was able to exist for so long without it looking like I had hair loss, that people would be like, I see hair on your head. What are you talking about? Doctors would be like, oh, you know, try to pull three hairs out, and they’re like, oh, it’s, you know, it’s just shedding. It’s like, stress. It’s nothing. You’re fine. Well, I wish those same doctors could see me now, because you were hella wrong. It was not just stress.

 

Ricki Lake  05:34

So for you, you started something called the women’s hair loss project. When did you start that, and why and and how did you do that?

 

Y  05:44

Yeah, because in 2007 and this, my hair loss began in 1999 and so I’m going through my 20s just floundering and trying to basically faking it through life, or, you know, not speaking about it too often, because nobody understood it, but trying to hide it, but really kind of dying inside, and like I was trying to do things to make myself feel better, but I had this secret, and it exact. It was just that. It was this secret that I carried with me, and every day I’d see myself basically what I call eroding in the mirror. It was difficult to look in the mirror. It was difficult to see the deflation of my hair the loss I would be sitting in the shower, and I would be handfuls would be coming out, and I’d be pasting it on the wall of the shower like an abacus, counting it out of like till 500 then I stopped counting, and then more came out. So every single day through my 20s, it was a struggle to live that way. And so I got to a point where in 2007 I just I was done like I was done pretending about this my life. I was done pretending about that I could, you know, pretend to be social or pretend to be this, and I wanted to just do nothing. I wanted to check out of life. So I decided to start a blog to because there was nothing out there to discuss what I was going through as a 20 something girl, woman dealing in this, the emotions of that and the anonymity also initially began because I felt like, How can I ever be completely raw and honest with all of my feelings that are going through and the devastation? So I wanted to be able to be as transparent as I could with whoever would ever find my sight. I was hoping that maybe one day somebody would find it and not feel as alone as I did. And when you start a blog, you know nobody knows it exists. If you exist, you put it up there, and maybe somebody finds it. And one day, I’ll never forget, I was sitting on my couch, and this girl, Mia, wrote a comment on one of my blogs, and it was literally the first time I ever realized I was not the only woman going through this. And imagine this was from 1999 and 20 into 2007 I was like, holy cow, it’s me and me and me and me are having hair loss. I’m like, there’s another woman out there. And it became one of those things where it’s like the fields of dreams, if you build it, they will come. And so I just kept blogging and then expanded it to adding a social network, and then women did come and had some source of place to turn to. It wasn’t a cure, but, you know, it’s not a cure to just talk to other people. But there is healing in community. There’s healing in talking to one another. There’s healing in US relating to what we’re going through when somebody else cannot relate to what it’s like to constantly be feel helpless and feeling a loss of identity and sense of control and like you spoke of and that shame, but having to keep it to yourself, yeah, you know.

 

Ricki Lake  08:28

Yeah, I feel so connected to you because we share this. This is such parallels in our experience. For me personally, I mean, I started noticing significant hair loss after I did a movie called Mrs. Winter, born in 1995 and in my case, I mean, I can’t remember. I was definitely on the pill at that time. I can’t remember. You know, I was about to start family planning, so I was going to be going off if I hadn’t gone off at that time anyway. But I was put on a crash diet by the producers of that movie, and I lost 35 pounds in nine weeks, and that shock of that caused, I mean, looking back, I mean, I’ve done so much kind of analyzing and research in my head about what caused it. But it was shortly after we finished filming the movie that I noticed in the shower just buckets of my hair falling out. And it was, I was doing my talk show at that time. You know, I had to be on camera every day. I had to have my hair done every day I had my hair colored. I think I was started coloring my hair around that time, because I was having I had gray hair, and it was humiliating. I was so ashamed. I felt so alone. And I discovered Philip Kingsley, which is, you know, he’s a trichola Thomas. How do you say it trichologist?

 

Y  09:39

It’s not really a doctor, but it’s a, I mean, they specialize in, kind of, like, looking more into, you know, the scalp and the follicles and stuff like that.

 

Ricki Lake  09:47

So I was, I was what, 25, 20 No, I was probably 26 years of age, and I’m, I’m doing my talk show by day, and going to his salon and his place, and they did some testing on my hair, and they said, I don’t even remember. What the diagnosis was, but my hair did come back. I did their scalp treatments. I did their protocol, which was shampoos and whatever I bought all the stuff. And my hair did recover somewhat. And then I had my first baby in 1997 and once I had the baby and breastfed for three months and stopped, the hair dumped again. And, I mean, it’s just it was it was it became my secret. You know, I wore a lot of hats all the time when I was going through shedding and, you know, over the years, I just kind of tried to think it away, and it never really totally came back. Let’s take a short break, and then we’ll be back with why.

 

Ricki Lake  10:54

So, okay, so cut to like my timeline. You know, I went through, you know, having my two kids, one at 28 one and 32 again, my hair would dump and it would come back. You know, I just had this balancing act. And then I did Dancing with the Stars in 2011 and that did a number on my hair. I had switched to extensions. By that time I started wearing I hadn’t worn extensions before, but in 2010 I started doing that, and that made it even worse. I mean, initially it looked amazing, and I loved it, but it always pulled on my already fine, delicate hair, and it would just make it worse. So each time, you know, I’d have to get it redone. And there they’d be having to grab more areas of my scalp to make these, these extensions work. And then I did that show. And you know, they have these incredible hairdos there, the whole team there? They make you look amazing, but then you’ve got to brush that shit out. And it’s just my hair would just be in a pile, and it was just me trying not to think about it. I’m trying to cover it up. It’s not really happening, but it is really happening. And you know, it was around that time that I was on the internet, late at night, and I found your site, and I was so scared to reach out to you. I was so I didn’t, you know, and part of the mix is that I’m a public figure, you know, and I’m on TV all the time, and I just was like, How can I reach out to someone and expose myself in this way? And I can’t even remember what I said to you, I mean, do you remember what I wrote?

 

Y  12:22

Well, you didn’t join as yourself, obviously.

 

Ricki Lake  12:25

Right? I had a fake name.

 

Y  12:27

Yeah, and then you divulged in DM to me a little bit more about your story. And just, you know how you wanted to like like, you said you I think you were very also Greg. You said, apprehensive, rightly so. You are a public figure. This is secretive for so many women, and I was imagine even more. So I’ve told you this before, like, I don’t even know. I mean, I have a tremendous respect for you to come out to do what you did in 2020 and put yourself out in the line like that. I mean, I’m an initial on, you know, I keep myself so private, and you went out there like balls to the walls, and are just like, this is it.

 

Ricki Lake  12:59

I felt like I had no choice at that point. Yeah, so I okay. You held my hand, and we went wig shopping together through the and I spent $20,000 on a few wigs that I never.

 

Y  13:10

I can think you spent more than that. I’m not mistaken.

 

Ricki Lake  13:13

It was so much money, but you, you held my hand like I will never, ever be able to, like, repay you for that kindness and that sisterhood that you get. I mean, I could, I’m getting teary eyed, just it meant so much to me, and continues to mean so much to me, because it was part of my journey through this very painful time. And ultimately, the wigs weren’t the answer for me. Bless the women that feel comfortable, and I know you, you were very comfortable in wigs. I never could get comfortable. It never felt right for me. It felt heavy, it felt hot, it felt I just couldn’t get used to it. And so I switched to this hair system, and you went with me to that salon too. You went with me and I sat in this, if this is like a specialty salon. And then I switched to a friend of mine, Mari, who’s someone who worked at that salon, she went and basically said, you know, I think I could have something that would be better for you. And basically she had this personalized system for me that I did for five years. For five years, I went to her basically every 10 to 14 days to have it tightened, because my as my hair would grow, you know, it would sit on my head like a toupee, she’d have to tighten it. So it became this thing that was, like the best of a bad situation. You know, it was like working for me. I could, I mean, you could look at pictures of me, does it look fake? I don’t know. I kind of just made it work for myself. And it was my secret. No one really knew. I’m trying to think I was with Christian, my husband, at that time, he knew a little bit to the extent that I was suffering still like I would cry, because I would still see the hair, the hair underneath, yes, would still shed in the shower. I didn’t. I got to the point where I didn’t want to shower, because it would just put me in a state. I would. I cry myself to sleep. You know, it’s just so debilitating. And so I did a show. This was coming up on 2020, the new decade, and I had done a show in London. I lived in London for for two and a half months. I had to fly Mari out to London to be able to do my hair, because I couldn’t go to any regular salon. And I’m still coloring my hair every two and a half weeks because the gray was still poking out underneath. Out underneath this toupee piece. So she came out and helped me. I said, I want, I think I’m at the breaking point where I just want to surrender to this. I just want to just fuck it like I cannot have this control me in this way anymore. And it’s like we were coming up on the end of this decade. It was the new year, and I just wanted to be set free of this pain. And because I’m a public figure, I knew I had to be public about it. I mean, I just, I just needed to be transparent about it. I wasn’t even thinking about that it would help other people. I was just wanting to be set free and and and liberated. And I called a good friend of mine, Amanda Demi, a photographer, and I said, Please, I want to document this. I want to, like, capture this.

 

Old Recording  16:07

Do you really think I pull this off? Wait, look down. I mean, I am so fucking excited not to have to, like, see all the hair in the shower drain.

 

Ricki Lake  16:22

Felt like lightning, like lightning of my my body, like, this weight had been lifted off of me and and I was ready, like I was ready. And I, you know, you don’t know what you look like bald until you do it. You know, like you really until you take that leap of faith. And I know you can probably relate like you didn’t know that you were gonna look this good with a shaved head, did you?

 

Y  16:43

I also didn’t know my brother would be staring back at me in the mirror, because I was like, Oh, we do look alike.

 

Ricki Lake  16:49

Yeah, so basically, I did this thing, and that, just like it exploded. To say it went viral is like an understatement, and the responses and the conversation that it started because I, as far as I know, I don’t know of any other public figure woman that has come out, maybe since there’s been some people like Jada Pinkett Smith, for example. And I mean, there’s been a handful of women that have come out, but I mean, it just exploded. And I’m not sure if I was in touch with you, did I give you a heads up that I was going to shave my head?

 

Y  17:20

So I did not know you were gonna shave your head. I was actually, I was sitting on my couch and I was on my phone. I was like, Holy shit, she did it. I was like, Holy shit, my hero. I’m not even kidding you, I’m sitting there. I’m like, unfriend believable. She did it like I was, I was amazed, so proud, like, honestly, my hero, like, if anybody doesn’t know, or I think shaving your head as a woman by not by choice, but to shave your head out of survival, of self preservation, for wanting to reclaim yourself and your power, is one of the most difficult things to actually do. That is the most difficult thing I’ve done in the 25 years of my hair loss, a five years of my hair loss life.

 

Ricki Lake  18:04

So yeah, so tell me you shaved your head, what you said 17 months ago, and what brought you to that point? Like, how did you get there? Because you had a secondary hair loss that was different from the first when you were 21 right?

 

Y  18:16

So turns out lightning can strike twice. So the first hair loss is female pad involvement, which I still do have. And then in 2022 my father passed away, and there’s a lot of stress that occurred around this time, just throughout from in many different it’s beyond the scope of this. But with all the assault to my system, the dermatologist, as I saw later in November, basically attributed that to affecting creating a non scarring, auto immune hair loss of the Alopecia Areata family, which they call it Alopecia Areata incognito, which is a kind of alopecia areata, typically is patches where they have the patchy hair loss. But there are many different forms. You have alopecia totalis, which is total loss of scalp hair. You have tilapia Universalis, which is all awesome body hair, all body hair, and then you have alopecia areata, lesser known incognito, which is basically more of a diffuse pattern, which can almost mimic female pattern baldness, which is also why it’s important for people to get a correct diagnosis, because one of these has the possibility to spontaneously reverse and the other one does not. But I ended up getting that, and my hair was just dumping like I’ve never seen before. I mean, in two months, it had clogged my drain, and I had very short hair at that time, it was carving out my temples. I could no longer look at myself in the mirror. I was losing myself all over again, after having learned to live with hair loss for over a decade, and feeling strong in what I was doing and feeling strong in wearing wigs, I was losing myself, and I was actually believe it. This was what people don’t realize, that I think that there is actually a post traumatic stress response to hair loss. Because while this was happening again, I had been wearing wigs. I had wigs, I had all of that. But. It didn’t matter. I was having primal screams in the shower, mental breakdowns that this was happening. How could this happen to me? All over again? What is this? I could no longer look at myself. I would brush my teeth in a beanie. I slept in a beanie, took it off to shower, then I’d cry. And this went on for all of 2022 and it was reaching a breaking point where I could no again, no longer exist. And then in months leading up to knowing that the only thing left on my ability of options to choose from, I couldn’t cut my hair any shorter, was to shave my head. The only thing that to save myself was to shave my head. But it’s like, you know that the answer, you know what can free you, but you can’t make it happen. It’s like, here’s the key to your not your freedom, maybe not your happiness, but your freedom. And you’re like, there’s the door, here’s your key, there’s the door. And you’re like, so the key to the door. How do I make this work? And it seems so simple, but it’s very complicated because you don’t know how to make that leap. It’s a leap of faith, and it’s a very scary one at that. And so I had gone to Sophie’s house May 7, 2023 to purchase a wig, a lace front wig. And I was like, I brought a shaver. And if I get I was like, if I get the balls to ask her to do this for me, because I knew I couldn’t do for myself. I had like, five failed attempts at trying to do it for myself, where I just sat on the floor crying. I needed somebody else to do it.

 

Ricki Lake  21:22

And Sophie explain who Sophie is. Sophie’s your best friend, but she also does the wig styling. She does the wig styling. So when I bought these wigs, I sat with her and she cut them and colored them for me, and so I got to know her a little bit. She’s super lovely and so generous with the women clients that she has.

 

Y  21:38

She’s amazing. And I think I needed this confirmation or affirmation or permission, although we should never need permission to do the things that we need. But I said to her, Do you think that I should do this? Do you think I should shave my head? And she did not stutter. She is like, 10,000% you are literally dying right now. You are dying. I’m watching you die right now, you’re losing yourself completely. She’s like, she’s she’s like, 10,000% she’s like, you’re sure you want to do this, 10,000% and that was the permission, I guess I needed, or the push that I needed, that I should have been able to give myself before, but I needed somebody else to say, yes, do this. And so that’s how we did it.

 

Ricki Lake  22:18

What did it feel like?

 

Y  22:21

I did not cry that day. Believe me, all the crying I did was before that day.

 

Ricki Lake  22:25

I didn’t cry that day either. I mean, I think I cried tears of joy, just you know that it was done and I was at peace. I don’t know if you felt that way. I felt at peace, right?

 

Y  22:35

Oh, my God, I want to tell you that I have to, because people ask me this question all the time. They’re like, like, what like? Oh, did you cry? What did you feel like? What Every all of my sadness and all of my pain existed before the day that I shaved my head, all of my torment, my not being able to look in the mirror anymore on my face. What was transpiring, the loss of hair in the shower. This will happen before May 7. May 7, once you put the chair in front of the mirror. Once you take that first swipe off your commitment, you’re committed now, but I felt nothing but relief when it was done. It was like, thank God. I’m like, it was done. It was something I never felt more relief in my life. It’s been an adjustment, but it was definitely, I always say it’s the second greatest thing I did for myself in my hair loss life. The first being starting to wear wigs helped me, but the second thing was shaving my head. I needed to do this. Not everybody needs to do this, but this was what I needed to set me free at this point in my hair loss life. No regrets, and I will that I’m never gonna actually grow my hair out. It will be like this forever.

 

Ricki Lake  23:41

And what about showering that first time without air?

 

Y  23:45

I love this question.

 

Ricki Lake  23:46

Because it’s the best. It was the best to say. It was orgasmic. I mean, that fits, right?

 

Y  23:51

I love this question, yeah, because my friend Lena, she shaved her head years ago, and her first question to me wasn’t like, how are you feeling? Her first question to me was, How good was that shower? How good was that first shower? I said, Oh my God, this was the best shower I’ve had in my life, probably ever. It was amazing. In fact, I’m gonna go back in and do it again.

 

Ricki Lake  24:16

Let’s take a short break, and then we’ll be back with, Y.

 

Ricki Lake  24:30

Can you and I talk about the things we did, the avenues we took to try to heal this otherwise, like PRP, we both did. You did that for years, right? You would fly to Florida, you would go and from California, from LA, you would go to Florida. How often to get this treatment and explain what this treatment is.

 

Y  24:49

Yeah, so I did it for 14 years, from 2009 to January. 2023 was the last treatment, because against this second hair loss, I just felt it wasn’t doing anything. After three fill. Treatments, but I was flying from LA to Florida every four to five months, because with any treatment, you actually have to continue to do it. There’s no one and done. There’s no package of eight. You have to continue doing this for life. For me, I felt PRP, it doesn’t work for everybody, but I felt it was worth it, and it slowed, helped to slow the progression of my hair loss, which means it’ll help stay in your head longer. If it’s slowing, it’s still falling out. It’s still, you know, got thinner over the years.

 

Ricki Lake  25:26

What is it? What is that procedure? It’s painful. It really hurts.

 

Y  25:30

Yeah, they’re using your own they’re taking your blood out of your arm, spinning it centrifuge. This is a very, you know, quickie way to say it. But they’re separating the platelets, which are the healing growth factors of that, and injecting it back into your scalp to help, I guess, stimulate growth or reduce the shedding, or, you know, provide benefit, in that regard.

 

Ricki Lake  25:48

They take an IV, they draw your own blood, they spin it, they take a certain portion, the platelets of your own blood, and they inject it into your scalp in little, tiny needles all over your head. Yes, I mean, I saw stars. It was so painful, like, I mean, it was, it was, I don’t think it helped me, but I was willing to try anything. I was on Propecia.

 

Y  26:11

I took Propecia.

 

Ricki Lake  26:12

You take it now?

 

Y  26:13

No, I took Propecia. And I took Propecia in 2000.

 

Ricki Lake  26:16

Yeah, Propecia is not FDA approved for women because of birth defects and because of something, it’s just not approved for women. But I begged my dermatologist to give me a prescription because I was at my wits end. Um, what are some of the other things? You know, minoxidil, Rogaine, what are some? What are some of the other things we’ve done?

 

Y  26:35

Initially, the first thing I did was there’s only thing at my resource was to go get Saw Palmetto from the vitamin store, because I was 20, I was 21 What was it going to get right?

 

Ricki Lake  26:44

Oh, I did that too. What is supplemental?

 

Y  26:47

It was an herb, but it kind of functions along the lines of Propecia, in the regards of how it’s affecting it’s affecting our hormones, and so it has the ability to, yes, help in the correct person, but it has the ability to also hurt. So many people have contacted me that took Saw Palmetto and said their hair got trashed from it. So then I went to the hairdresser, and then they they had Nioxin, which did nothing as well.

 

Ricki Lake  27:12

That’s topical, right? Nyoxin is something you put topically.

 

Y  27:15

It’s like a shampoo that, pretty much I feel, does nothing, but they sell it in salons. Then I got on 5% Rogaine, which is, you know, minoxidil, and topically. And then I was put on Propecia. And I also, then I was put on 200 milligrams of Aldactone, which is the brand name of Spironolactone.

 

Ricki Lake  27:39

Oh, I was on that to Spironolactone. I was on that for a long, long time, and that is a drug that’s used for blood pressure.

 

Y  27:46

I think, correct, yeah. And so it’s also a diuretic, yeah.

 

Ricki Lake  27:49

And it’s a diuretic, right? I did that for years, okay? What else?

 

Y  27:53

So, 13 years, by the way, trapped on that. I want to use that word because I felt trapped on that medication, because I was scared to get off. What would happen? So is it helping? Is it making it worse? I don’t know. I just was scared, and then I they also this one was the worst one. I feel I did for myself. I was so desperate when I got off the pill, I swore to myself I would never, ever go back on a pill ever again. I knew it happened, but a year later, I was singing a different tune. When I’m in desperation. They said, well, if we put you back on a quote, unquote, hair friendly pill, this can help stabilize your hormones. Okay, as there is such thing as a hair friendly pill. There is no such thing as a hair friendly pill, in my opinion, because every single pill that’s been cited as a hair friendly pill in the last 17 years of talking to women, they have told me they thought that pill was responsible for their hair loss, so they put me on a hair friendly pill, which then I was stuck on for another 13 years. And I only got the courage to come off of Aldactone and come off of the birth control pill after I started wearing wigs, and I felt okay. Whatever happens, happens. At least I started I have wigs. It’s my backup, and that’s so I got off of those medications, both of those in 2013 that’s when I stopped systemically treating my hair loss in 2013.

 

Ricki Lake  29:10

Wow okay, and what do you think of […]?

 

Y  29:16

So it’s so prevalent and popular out there are people talking about and stuff like that. I don’t have any personal experience with the product itself. I’ve heard from people that have taken it, you know, but ultimately, it’s a supplement that can help your hair look better, look healthier, maybe be stronger. But if you think that it’s going to actually restore your hair to its full capacity, I don’t actually think that’s going to be a thing.

 

Ricki Lake  29:42

You don’t think so, but it can’t hurt, right?

 

Y  29:44

Well, it could. It actually can in some regards, and the reason why is because they’re one of the ingredients in, I don’t know if it’s in all of the formulations, but saw palmetto is present. Saw Palmetto affects your hormones, so you can’t just take Saw Palmetto. Don’t think nothing can happen. I don’t have a personal dog in the race of their their product whatsoever. It’s just to me, it’s just about being fully educated and informed. And also, usually you have to understand that if it sounds too good to be true, oftentimes it kind of is.

 

Ricki Lake  30:18

Do you have a theory as to why? Like, my hair kind of grew back, because it’s, it’s sort of, I mean, I to say it’s a miracle. I don’t know. I mean, I was, I was endorsing that product Heart Clinic, in which I do absolutely believe it helped my scalp be as healthy as it could be. I think there’s a lot of other factors. I think the fact that I no longer color my hair, I no longer wear extensions, I think these are all factors. Yeah, I don’t put heat on my hair very often. I don’t blow it out anymore. Like I kind of and, and I’m at peace with it, like, I don’t stress about it, you know. Like, I think that the mind, the brain, can absolutely be a factor in, you know, the health of anything, any part of your body, you know, being at peace with something. What do you think?

 

Y  31:01

I think you taking the weight off your hair, for one, because you had been wearing extensions for so long, and also the integration system put weight on your hair. So that was one, like you said, the stress relieving yourself of that stress of maybe hiding, or the shame, or whatever, that’s stress, stress people I always used to, I roll my eyes about stress can cause hair loss, but stress can absolutely be a contributing cause to exacerbating female pattern baldness or any other type of hair loss. It could be the single cause, but it could also be an exacerbating cause. So you could have been worsening in a situation you freed yourself. I mean, there, I do believe a lot in the the mind body connection. I think there’s so much to that. I mean that, yeah, I mean so many factors. I think there’s so many factors that were probably involved in that.

 

Ricki Lake  31:49

And I have to say, I have come to a place of I really I love my natural hair color. I never thought that I’d be in a place where I like looking in the mirror and seeing like, it’s crazy, isn’t the best feeling? Yeah. I mean, maybe, what do you have to say to people that are going through this and they’re dating like, for you? Are you? I don’t know if you’re single these days. Are you? Yeah, does it? I’m sure it’s not an issue for you at this point in your life. But for people just starting out with wig wearing, what advice do you have for them?

 

Y  32:20

You need to be very trusting of the person you’re trusting that information with, because I feel like, you know, I’m really willing to share because I’ve done it so much so I can kind of withstand whatever the reaction would be. But if you’re in a fragile state, you have to be very mindful of who you’re sharing this very sensitive information with, because I believe He can set you back. You could have an adverse reaction from a man or a woman or whoever you’re telling to, and that could set you back, the rejection, the potential rejection. So here you are trying to lift yourself up and move forward, and you’re opening yourself up for the first time. And if it’s with the wrong person that can actually really set you back, but if it’s with the right person, it could help actually elevate you and get you to a better place, because that person would be supportive, that person wouldn’t bat an eye. I mean, I’ve told many, many people I’ve met be men, blah they all know the situation. They knew it before the shave. They knew it after the shave. They no one’s actually been like, Oh my God. Like, you know, what is this? I think that’s because I’m comfortable in what I do, the delivery of that. And I think that women, they’re so afraid to date, they’re afraid of what will happen if I gonna have sex, what will happen, you know, in that process. But I feel like those are the conversations that had to be had before you got to that point, because that’s the person you’re trusting a really intimate part of yourself with. To me, hair loss is extremely intimate. So if you’re running away from the table, if I’m telling you why I’m wearing a wig, you can run away from the table. I’ll get a glass of wine and, you know, we’ll call it a day.

 

Ricki Lake  33:56

Yeah, it is a good way to kind of weed out the the duds, right?

 

Y  34:00

It’s a weeding out process you running away from the fact that I have hair loss. I can’t change that. I cannot change this aspect of myself. You accept me as I am, or you don’t.

 

Ricki Lake  34:10

When I was wearing that hair piece, I was so sensitive. I didn’t want a man to touch my hair. Yeah, you know, I didn’t want anyone touching my hair. I mean, I have, like, a visceral reaction thinking back to when I had that, I didn’t want people knowing that I had this like piece on the top of my head, and I was, you know, dating at that time.

 

Y  34:29

I would love for women in general. And that does come from conversation, that does come acceptance and awareness of people, of having this dialog, but to be less ashamed of what they’re doing. For yourself. If you have confidence in what you’re doing, you’re not ashamed of what you’re doing, so you’re able to deliver and have more strength in that process. So like I said, then it’s a weeding out process, because if that person, man or woman, is having an adverse reaction to your situation that you’re disclosing, then this is not your person.

 

Ricki Lake  35:00

Mm, hmm, your your site, the women’s hair loss project, and your, you know, your Instagram, and however, anybody can find you. You do this for no money.

 

Y  35:10

Yes, I make no money from this. Not opinion.

 

Ricki Lake  35:13

Wow, I mean, that is just unbelievable to me. And as far as your followers, I mean, I mean, you’ve just grown and grown and grown what? What would you say to someone that’s struggling with this issue and they don’t know where to turn? What do you recommend?

 

Y  35:30

That’s a very good question. Um, you know, I would first say this when you first start losing your hair. I think one of the main things that are going to strike your core is that you will never be able to live your life. You’ll never have happiness, you’ll never find love, you’ll forever be alone. You can never make this work, although this is not a direction to tell them what they should do. I would want that woman to know that that is what you feel in this moment, but it is not accurate, because we can, I believe we all can do this. It’s not like you had special powers or I had special powers. It’s all within us to be able to move through this in our own way, however way we find to make this work, whether it’s taking whatever you want to take, you want to take nutrafol, you want to take minoxidil, whatever you need to do in your life, wear wigs. Don’t wear wigs. Shave your head. Tell the planet, don’t tell the world, you can make this work, but people should give up, or try to give up, trying to make their decisions based on what society thinks people hold up your entire life. I don’t want to wear a wig. I don’t want to do this because I’m afraid of what other people will think. But now you’re holding up your life based on the thoughts of other people. You’ll never live your life that way. You have to kind of move past that. That’s like the internal work that I think occurs within us. We have the practical we can talk about, the medication, this, that and the other thing, a lot of the work that I think is the harder work, is learning to live in this process, learning to process for ourselves. How do you learn to love this new reflection. How do I learn to accept this is my new reality? How do I let go that I won’t ever be the girl that had enough hair for three people, it will never happen and for the rest of my life, and accept that this is a new phase of my life, and maybe find good in that, find gratitude in what this will bring for the future. You know, it’s different things. I think it’s a lot of I’m very much a mindset person. I’m very much into, you know, the power of our thoughts and what we can do with that.

 

Ricki Lake  37:29

Absolutely, I love everything you’re saying. And I think the internet and Instagram for me, I mean, there’s a real community what you have, and other people like hair loss, bonita, that sweet woman. And there’s another woman that deals with toppers. I can’t remember her name. I’m blanking on her name, but I love her content. Yeah, I feel like anyone that is struggling in silence and feels alone, there is support out there. Do you feel like you’re living your purpose? Because I feel like you are doing freaking God’s work, certainly for me.

 

Y  38:04

Thank you. That means a lot to me actually. You know, I used to say I didn’t choose my path, it chose me. And that’s pretty much what I feel, and that’s still why I do this 17 years later, and I feel that it gives purpose to my own situation, I feel like, where else in my life would I have gotten the opportunity to make a small difference in somebody else’s life so that they don’t feel alone? You know, it’s hair loss is something that is so misunderstood, and so many women are struggling right now, day in and day out. I mean, the DMS, the emails, the women that can’t, they’re four decades in five decades, and they’re in their 70s, they’re like, I lost my life, and they’re still struggling, because they still can’t make it work. And you write those people back, don’t you? I write as many people back as I can. I can’t write everybody back, but I do try to do my best to reach as many people as I can, to convey the message that, while you don’t see hope today, hope actually exists, you know.

 

Ricki Lake  39:02

Have you thought of writing a book?

 

Y  39:05

I have, yes, I have had time to have people have also.

 

Ricki Lake  39:08

I really think you should I do, I really think so. I wanted to write a book after my experience, after I shaved my head, and all of the fallout from that. Haha, pun intended, Fallout get it. But I, you know, whatever, I shopped an idea around, and they thought it was the publishing houses thought it was too narrow that. But I think there’s so much to this topic and this experience that I went through, that you’ve gone through, that so many women go through. And I thank you so much for being there for so many of us. And you, you know, you say you’ve helped people in a small way, you’ve helped me in a huge way. And I hope you know that I am forever grateful to you.

 

Y  39:51

And now you’re free. You are free. Honestly, you see living your best life, and it’s incredible, and I know the struggle.

 

Ricki Lake  39:58

Yeah, thank you so. And I hope you know people listening got something out of this conversation, and know that they’re not alone in this really, really painful journey. It can be very painful, but I feel like there’s a reason this happened to me, and I love that I’m like a conduit and a you know, I hate role model. I hate saying that, but like I.

 

Y  40:19

You are role model. You, you, you put yourself out there in the forefront. I mean, you that’s, I can’t imagine the strength that that takes. Like, actually you can’t see through my, all my blackness here, but it my the I have chills when I think about it, because putting yourself out there in that way, it changed so many lives. It made Harold brought more awareness to hair loss. It brought more acceptance towards the things that people have to do, making mean it powerful and the choices that you can make. You gave women permission to, you know, feel okay in that, and that makes you a freaking hero.

 

Ricki Lake  40:57

Thank you so much. I feel like you helped me. You helped me along the way. And Mari, shout out to Mari, my friend who did my hair for a very long time. It’s like, it’s really good to be on the other side of it. You know, I hope you feel the same way. It feels so good.

 

Y  41:14

It does feel good. Yeah, 10,000%

 

Ricki Lake  41:17

Y, thank you so much for being here, I love you.

 

Y  41:20

Thank you so much for having me here. I love you so much. This was such an honor, thank you.

 

CREDITS  41:27

You know guys like one of the reasons for doing this podcast is for interviews like that. You know it’s just, I know many people can’t relate to this subject matter, but for me, it is so personal, and I’m just so grateful to be able to have this conversation with someone that really was instrumental in my path to self acceptance and true self love. And I just really hope you got something out of this talk. And if you’re not going through this issue personally, I promise you have someone close to you in your life that is, please share this episode with them. Thank you to why. To learn more about the women’s hair loss project, check out her website, womensharelosproject.com you can also find why on Instagram @WHLPNetwork. Thank you so much for listening. And there is much more The High Life with Lemonada premium subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content like rapid fire questions with our recent guest, Melissa Urban of whole 30 fame. Subscribe now in Apple podcasts. The High Life is a production of Lemonada Meida. Isabella Kulkarni and Kathryn Barnes, produced our show. Our mixes by James Sparber. Executive Producers are Stephanie Wittels Wachs and Jessica Cordova Kramer. Additional Lemonada support from Rachel Neel and Steve Nelson. You can find me  @Rickilake on Instagram. Follow The High Life with Ricki Lake, wherever you get your podcasts, or listen ad free on Amazon music with your Prime membership.