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Which TV ensemble would make for a better hang: journalist Candice Lim’s choice of New Girl or audio producer Ronald Young Jr.’s pick of Community? That’s up to Aminatou Sow to decide! Would you rather spend time with a crew who are all at the prime TV cool age (aka late 20s/early 30s), or with people of all ages and backgrounds? Which show had the better guest stars … and the better hijinks? And how does Jess’s quirkiness compare with Pierce’s problematic ways? Aminatou weighs the answers to these questions and more to decide which cast would be more fun to add to her social circle.

Follow Candice Lim @thecandicelim on X and Ronald Young Jr @OhitsBIGRON on X and Instagram.

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Transcript

SPEAKERS

Speaker 2, Candice Lim, Ronald young Jr., Speaker 1, Candice, Aminatou Sow

Aminatou Sow  01:46

You’re listening to Pop Culture Debate Club. I’m Aminatou Sow. Each week we bring together two guests to duke it out over a pop culture obsession. I’ll be asking them a series of questions, and whoever successfully convinces me wins. You up today, we’re discussing which TV ensemble would make for the best hang. Let’s meet our panelists.

 

Aminatou Sow  02:15

Joining me today is Candice Lim, co host of Slate’s ICYMI podcast, Candice, welcome to the show.

 

Candice Lim  02:22

Hello.

 

Aminatou Sow  02:24

Also with us today is Ronald Young Jr, the host of the TV and film podcast, Leaving The Theater as well as the host of Wait For It. Hi, Ronald, I’m so happy that you’re here with us today.

 

Speaker 1  02:35

Hello. I’m a now too. I am happy to be here. Hello, Candace,  I’m excited about this.

 

Aminatou Sow  02:40

Okay, Candice, let’s get into it. What did you choose?

 

Candice Lim  02:44

So my pick is New Girl. I love this show. This show is just such pure energy, great vibes, friends that you genuinely would want to hang out with day to day to day and Okay, I think, as someone who watched this like, in middle school and kept binging it on Netflix as an adult. This show never gets old for me, because I connect with all of them and like this very prism way of like, I see myself in all of you like a pie. And so that’s my pick, New Girl.

 

Aminatou Sow  03:14

Wow, okay, coming in strong. But Ronald, what show did you pick for today?

 

Speaker 1  03:19

Now here’s the thing, I like new girl, but I still think that my pick is better. Let me just come off the top rope with that one. I am going to the fictional town of Greendale Community College to hang out with the study group all of the gag. We’re talking Troy and Abed in the morning. We’re talking Britta Perry. We’re talking Jeff winger and all of the cast of community, I think they would be the best hang Let me ask y’all a question, do y’all like diversity?

 

Aminatou Sow  03:51

Wow, first of all, how dare you?  I ask the questions here, do you like diversity?

 

Ronald young Jr.  04:01

Yeah, I do. Do you like sexual tension?

 

Aminatou Sow  04:06

How dare you?

 

Speaker 1  04:11

I do and I like hi Jinks as well. And this show has all three. That is my opening argument.

 

Aminatou Sow  04:17

Okay, so your mission, clearly, is to win me over with your pick today, right? And Ronald has already gone very strongly with his opening argument, but I want to slow down and talk and ask you, Ronald to tell me a little bit more about the show.

 

Ronald young Jr.  04:35

Okay, so Jeff Winger, played by Joel McHale, is a former lawyer who is, for some reason, disbarred, which is revealed as it goes on in the show, I think it’s pretty revealed pretty early in season one, if I’m not mistaken, and he goes to Greendale Community College in an effort to write some wrongs with his past in terms of his education and his path to becoming a lawyer while. He’s there, he joins an introductory Spanish class that is taught by Ken Jeong, that is taught by Ken Jeong as Ben Chang, senior Chang, as he calls himself, and in an effort to make sure that he’s getting the best grades in class, he kind of stumbles into starting a study group with a cast of characters that is very diverse in both race and in thought, and it gender, just about anything that you could think of, and hijinks ensue. That is kind of the plot of the show. I like the show because mainly it tells a story of what it is actually like to be a part of a community college, a college generally, but they nail the idea of community college. Well, if anyone’s ever been to community college, it is a bunch of what feels like a hodgepodge of people all at one place, all going for goals that feel similar, but puts you next to people that you might not choose to be around, and this plays into those kind of differences and similarities very well.

 

Aminatou Sow  06:05

Okay, Candice, I’m gonna give you a chance to do the same for your show, for the people at home who are not familiar with New Girl.

 

Candice Lim  06:13

So Zoe de Chanel stars in the show. She plays a teacher who moves in with three guys into this loft in downtown LA and I would say Jess is very like quintessential Manic Pixie girl. She is very quirky. She sings randomly out of nowhere. I wanna be honest, if I met her in real life, I’d probably want to stab her. But the thing is, I think this show does a good job of bouncing her out with people that are like genuinely funny people. So you have Nick, that’s Jake Johnson. You have Schmidt, who was his college roommate, and is now just like this type a marketing guy, but he works at an agency that’s woman only, which is very funny to me. And then we have coach, Damon Wayans Jr, very good, very funny, interesting story. There we have Cece, who is a model, and Jess childhood best friend, and I’m saving the best for last, Winston, who is played by Lamar Morris, cartoon personified. I mean, he stole a cat from Brenda’s song. He’s like Willy Wonka on this show. I love everything about this cast, because I think this show really gives them a lot of grace in terms of tracing their characters, and they let them grow and fall in love and do all these things that I think really encapsulates that, like late 20s, early 30s, existence of like, I’m an adult with roommates, and I don’t want to grow up, but I have to, so can we do it together? And I think that’s actually very sweet. And the thing is, Ronald, I see you. I see you because hijinks also ensue in this show often, to the point of they go to Prince’s house, to the point of they try to stalk one of Jess students because they think he’s going to murder her. And at the end of the day, I I think we all just want to hop into a car that we don’t have to drive and go somewhere, and that’s fun.

 

Ronald young Jr.  07:56

Has the debate portion begun? Because I’d like to debate.

 

Aminatou Sow  07:58

Hi, Jason, the domain portion began the minute you started arguing. And, you know, we I wish I had a bell and could go like, round one, round two, round three. Well, Candice, let’s get into it. Like, which of the characters on New Girls specifically, do you think is the best hank?

 

Candice Lim  08:16

So this is a good question, because, you know, community was on my short list as well. I considered it. And the thing is, when I was thinking about what show would I want to hang out with most one, I was thinking composite of like, I would love to connect with one person, but I would like to be accepted by all. And I was also thinking like, look at all the guest stars on these shows, who has the best edit, like, who gets treated well and fairly and openly and all that stuff. So with new girl, I think it’s more of like, this is not like a are you a Chandler? Are you a Ted? This is more of like, I think New Girl is a prism through which every character holds a certain percentage of your true makeup. And so when I first started the show, I was like, I might be a Jess, but as an adult, I think my percentages have changed. I think I’m a bit of like a cc Sun Schmidt Moon coach rising.

 

Aminatou Sow  09:08

Wow, for the astrology people at home, this is who you’re pandering to. I love that for you.

 

Candice  09:15

And I have Nick and Winston on the bench, in case I need them. I need Jess in case I need to go to the DMV. I think all of these people carry something in their pockets that are useful to me at any time of day.

 

Aminatou Sow  09:28

Okay, what about you, Ronald?

 

Candice  09:30

Okay, so with the show like community, you don’t have to pick one person that you would hang with, because if you show up to Greendale Community College, there is probably a click that will fit you in there. Now, you probably won’t necessarily be able to get into the study group. Many people have tried and failed, but if you don’t, there are plenty of other groups that you can join into. Now let’s be clear, you can hang out with Troy and Abed. You could go to a party at their apartment, and maybe Annie will be there too. But I think one of the strengths of a Greendale Community College, and the characterization of the characters is that you have so many that you’re interested in, even though they’re not a part of the main crew. There’s people like star birds, who is just like your typical bird owl with star birds at a top hat. There’s Leonard, who is a geriatric member of the community college who is just always up the hijinks with this posse of old folks who are just running around creating havoc on campus. And then there’s magnitude pop. It’s just popular for no reason.

 

Aminatou Sow  10:30

I forget that that’s where that comes from. Pop like wow.

 

Speaker 1  10:33

There’s so in terms of hanging out, if I, if I enrolled in Greendale Community College, there’s opportunities for you to kind of fit in with anyone at Greendale Community College.

 

Aminatou Sow  10:43

I don’t know that seems pretty like you’re really swaying me towards this universe. That I have to confess is it’s not a it’s not a natural fit for me to be excited about community, and now all I want to do is re watch all of it.

 

Ronald young Jr.  10:57

So I’m telling you, you fit right in. I’m gonna too you gotta go.

 

Aminatou Sow  11:01

I like, I don’t know that I fit right in. But, you know, I’m, I would audit a class, is what I’m saying. You know, like, that’s fair. It’s, I’m so struck that both of you are talking about two shows that definitely feel like TV, you know, I think that there’s, there’s so much.

 

Ronald young Jr.  11:16

Like TV.

 

Aminatou Sow  11:17

Right? Everyone is making, you know, like, TV is great because there’s so much of it. It’s, it’s endless. It the form is, you know, like, it’s constantly morphing. It’s kind of exciting to be in an art form that is less than 100 years old. You’re like, Oh, we’re just, we are still, we’re still making the thing. But you’re both talking about, like, very classic TV, TV Tropes, like, down to the hijinks.

 

Speaker 1  11:37

I think, for both shows, like, what they were were, they were the last and the first, so they were the last of like, in a lot of ways, of traditional television, as you say, where you kind of had to worry about commercials, you had to worry about setup, punchline, joke. But a lot of the work that was done in these, and I would say, the companion series for new girl being happy endings, a lot of ways, especially with the connection of Damon Wayne’s Jr being in both when you think about the ways in which television was in the golden age, in the early odds into the early teens, in a way where Mad Men was on Breaking Bad, these were sitcoms that none of us kind of expected to be good and for us to attach to. You know what I mean? So I feel like, for me, and especially the fact that that community, which I would like to give another point to myself.

 

Aminatou Sow  12:25

I give the points here.

 

Ronald young Jr.  12:27

That also starts a bit of the streaming area era with Yahoo screen, which is RFP Yahoo screen, but kind of like starts that kind of foray into more what we know as television of today now to be like kind of hybrid digital and analog. So I feel like what we were looking at here, we didn’t even really know that this was kind of the last and the first, and it’s kind of this push into television as we know it today, which is a little bit more it’s heartfelt, but it’s still a little bit more sarcastic. It’s a little bit more snarky both shows. It’s still a little bit more leaning into, like, kind of the uncoolness and the awkwardness and the anxiety that a lot of millennials are dealing with today, but we didn’t have a show like that for us until the aughts and the teens before that. I think I’m not even sure like what we had, we had shows we were attached to, but nothing that really defined our generation. And I think these shows are among a cohort that started to do that.

 

Aminatou Sow  13:19

Candice, you agree with that?

 

Candice  13:21

I do. I think it’s really funny, Ronald, that you brought up the flop season of community on Yahoo, because that dig on you.

 

Aminatou Sow  13:30

Trash.

 

Candice  13:33

I agree, I remember at the time there were some great shows on like Glee, The Mindy Project, Brooklyn, nine, nine. And there was something about the way that new girls stood out for me in that, yes, it would eventually become like this, softer, warmer, comfort watch. And when I think about it, I think about the guest stars they were able to book right? They had Rob Reiner on there, playing just as dad. They had Jamie, Lee, Curtis, Megan Fox Prince, let’s talk about my trump card Prince. Prince loved New Girl.

 

Aminatou Sow  14:07

That’s a pretty good point in your camp.

 

Candice  14:09

Yeah, so Prince loved New Girl so much that he said, I want to make a cameo, and I will only make the CAMEO if you get Jess and Nick together, otherwise I’m not doing it. And I was like, first off power moves, but second prince and Taylor Swift walked onto these shows. They were fans, and they weren’t even, like, the best guest stars of, like, the entire thing. And so I just think there was this, like, outsized loved from, like, everywhere that I felt, and I don’t know, maybe at the end of the day, Prince is just like me. We just want to hang out and afford flex with all these people and go get yogurt, you know?

 

Aminatou Sow  14:50

Well, that’s pretty remarkable, because I just watched that, you know, the documentary about the we are in the world song. I forgot what the doc is called, but Prince notorious for. For being a hater and not wanting to go to that recording that night. So it’s funny to me that you’re like, he like marched himself in onto the set of new girls when he would not march himself to sing with his peers. Yeah, let’s take a quick break. We’ll be back in a minute.

 

Speaker 1  16:07

And we’re back, Candice. What’s something about new girl that you think most people don’t know?

 

Candice Lim  18:37

Yeah, so on top of Prince walking onto the show just because he wanted to. I love talking about Damon Wayans JR and his role in the show. So basically, when they shot the pilot for New Girl, Damon Wayans Jr is in it. Lamar Morris is not. And at the time, Damon was already cast on happy endings, they had shot a season all this stuff. He thought Happy Endings was not going to get picked up for a second season. So he said, yeah, let me do a new girl be girl. It’d be so fun. New Show. I love, a paycheck. Happy Endings does end up getting picked up. And he’s like, ah, I guess I have to choose. And so he ends up doing happy endings. They bring in LA morene Morris and Le Morne was not really a character in the pilot. Winston wasn’t really a fully formed idea. And so that first season, they basically give la more the opportunity to build a character on his own, to build quirks, to build little affectations, and to just like free form it. And I think that is actually really, really fun and beautiful, because he really made Winston, like a very, very big favorite, iconic character. Now Happy Endings does end up getting canceled after three seasons, and Damon ends up coming back, and he just kind of picks up as, like, coach and like, I just love that the new girl team didn’t hold it against Damon for being on another sitcom, and instead just let him come back and like, gave him actually a really good you. Character arc that made me cry at one point, like this show, I think, is the reason why Damon Wayans Jr is, like, one of my favorite comedic actors, and I think that, plus happy endings, like, what a what a run for him, what a Wikipedia page.

 

Aminatou Sow  20:14

It’s, uh, it’s great. What about you? Um, Ronald, what’s a little fun fact about your show that you want to plug.

 

Ronald young Jr.  20:22

There’s a lot of easter eggs in a community you could probably like. If you watch the show, you see something new every time, especially from the ways that they’re talking to each other. The dialog is really fast. But one of my favorite ones was one that a friend pointed out to me that upon my second watch I actually paid attention to, which is that there was a show, a movie in the 90s, which I’m sure you’re both familiar with, called Beetlejuice. And you know that if you say Beetlejuice, his name three times, Beetlejuice, played by Michael Keaton, will will show up to solve mysteries or take care of your problems, or whatever it was that Beetlejuice was supposed to be doing, and this in community over the course of three seasons, they said the name Beetlejuice three times, and on the third in the third season, if you’re paying attention, Beetlejuice walks by in the background, which is incredible, like if and it’s over the course you have to it’s great for binge watch, because as soon as you see it happen. It happens very quickly. But it was little details like that that I always found really interesting about that show, that they were always kind of just painting a little bit of fun into, like, the edges of the show just kind of like coming at you all the time. And that was one where I’m just like, wow, the whoever was in the writers room was just like, oh, here’s a chance for us to do something in a couple of seasons, and it’s not so flashy that it would take away from whatever was going in the main plot. So I love that community did stuff like that all the time.

 

Candice Lim  21:48

Yeah, you know what’s funny? There’s also a Michael Keaton moment in New Girl, where Schmidt, his entire life, thinks he’s been emailing Michael Keaton, but it was actually his mom, and Nick ends up taking over the email account and like sending him like basically therapist notes, which is hilarious, but maybe this podcast is absolutely about Michael Keaton. Interesting.

 

Aminatou Sow  22:07

Today, we’ll be discussing Birdman and your feelings about it. One of my favorite tropes in modern TV, TV or early aughts TV, is that kind of like mis correspondence, like technology trope, remember, like in the office when created thought that he had a blog and it was really just a Google, you know, like, it’s really just a Google document, and it was like, pre thought, you know, like, www, whatever. I remember the first time I saw that. Like, I it’s like, still a top 10 laugh for me. Well, you know, I also Ronald, since you brought up diversity so many times, since you are such a champion of Dei, I am, you know, as people of flavor, it’s just things we have to, we have to bring up. I’m just like wondering, for both of you, like re examining the show that you love, like through this 2024, lens. Is there anything about it that doesn’t hold up for you? Is there anything that you like struggle with, or it feels like cringy now today?

 

Ronald young Jr.  23:04

I think the only thing that doesn’t really hold up for community is its creator, Dan Harmon, who has had some troubles in the past, which you can google and kind of look at, but the work itself, I think community, After re watching, it still holds up. There’s one episode that was taken down in 2020 that they called a black face episode, which I don’t know if I would call it that. It is with Ken Jung, who is dressed up as a dark elf. And I thought the joke was funny at some point, Yvette Nicole Brown looks over because it’s Halloween or no, it’s Dungeons and Dragons. She looks over at Ken junks, who is covered head to toe in blackface, in black paint, as an elf. And she goes, Are we gonna ignore this hate crime over here? And he goes, what? I’m a dark elf. And I laughed. I thought the joke was funny. That episode is gone. And it was gone as like, kind of like a knee jerk reaction to a lot of folks saying, well, black face is always bad, without really doing a critical examination of like, what actually is blackface in a lot of cases. And I think this playing along the lines of saying this person dressed up in black paint could also be considered blackface, is kind of lampooning the idea of blackface itself, which I think, for me, works. So I don’t even know if that episode exists in the canon anymore, or I don’t know if you could find it on streaming, or anything like that. But other than that, I mean, a lot of in a lot of ways, community was incredibly progressive and ahead of its time, and kind of like addressing these types of relationships, I think it holds up to a good re watch in today’s age.

 

Ronald young Jr.  24:40

What about you, Candice?

 

Candice Lim  24:43

Well, actually, Ronald, I gotta cross examine you a little bit. Are we gonna talk about Pierce? Love it. We love it. Are we talk about Pierce?

 

Ronald young Jr.  24:50

Chevy Chase? We can because I think the idea of Pierce and the things that he was doing to me sit the same way that Michael Scott did, where the idea of this person is that no. Likes them, and we don’t like what they’re doing. And they exist, not for them to just do whatever they want to do, but for us to be like we don’t want to be like Michael Scott, or we don’t want to be like Pierce. So Pierce Hawthorne is he’s an older man in the in the study group, and he is extremely problematic. He is a person that is like he says. He says whatever’s on his mind. He talks about the black folks in the group. He talks disparagingly about the women in the group. But also the group is very dismissive of in a very specific way, to the point where towards the end of the of Chevy Chase’s run on the show, it turns out there was a lot of behind the scenes stuff going on that kind of proved, to prove to bear that Chevy Chase wasn’t very different from the Pierce Hawthorne character, and that people didn’t like him. Donald Glover has come out and said, I didn’t really like Chevy Chase. There’s a lot of ways we didn’t get along. There’s ways he talked about my race, all of that. So I think in terms of, I still want that character to exist, if not to be a cautionary tale for folks of what not to be. But I think sometimes people can see a character like that and not realize that that’s not the character you’re supposed to aspire to be. So they see that example instead of looking at that and saying, I don’t want to be that. They’re like, oh, wow, this person’s cool. I don’t think that’s the case for Pierce Hawthorne, so I think it’s okay if he still exists.

 

Candice Lim  26:18

Yeah, he went method, and you’re separating art from the artist, correct? So here’s the thing I yeah. I think the tough thing is that, like when we talk about the central tenant here, you know who would be a good hang, I do agree with you that, like Abed, Troy, Annie, absolutely great people to chill out with. They are so lawful good, but that that Pierce card on top of Joel McHale just being like so smarmy I’d feel like an endangered species. I don’t know if I could do it.

 

Ronald young Jr.  26:51

All right, if we’re opening it up to saying who I would not like to hang out with.

 

Aminatou Sow  26:56

Hold on Candice, you have, like, talked about why you would not hang out on the community set. What’s the problematic thing about hanging out in your crew?

 

Candice Lim  27:07

I think, if I like, kind of think about, you know, does New Girl stand up in 2024 most of it, yes. I’m not gonna call New Girl completely innocent. If I do like, a very thorough re watch, I may have like, scenes or like line readings that don’t strike me as clean cut. For example, one of my favorite guest stars on the show is Ralph on who played Tran who is like this really adorable grandpa who sits with Nick while he’s having a mental breakdown and kind of therapies him back into life by holding him like a baby in a community swimming pool. I love the way they talk about Ralph […] who has passed since, and they have so much respect for him. But a part of me is wondering, is there something a little coded there about having this character walk on who is an elder Asian person who does not speak a single line of dialog. Is there something there that maybe they capitalize on and kind of use as a plot device without really interrogating like, hey, are we? Are we calling them voiceless? Let’s have a let’s have that conversation.

 

Aminatou Sow  28:15

It’s time for a quick break. We’ll be back in a minute.

 

Aminatou Sow  29:25

How’s everyone doing?

 

Candice Lim  29:50

Are we still friends?

 

Ronald young Jr.  29:50

Good to go.

 

Ronald young Jr.  29:52

Absolutely.

 

Aminatou Sow  29:52

Yeah.

 

Candice Lim  29:53

Okay, good.

 

Aminatou Sow  29:53

What are you talking about?

 

Candice Lim  29:55

I just, you know, getting a vibe check here, because at some point I was like, Is this anatomy of a fall? Are we about to go to for. Into court where.

 

Aminatou Sow  30:01

First of all, this soon into anatomy of a fall, somebody was already dead, so.

 

Candice  30:07

It was fierce. Just kidding.

 

Aminatou Sow  30:10

Okay, now that we have a lot of background on both of your picks and what you really, really, really like about them. Candace, I I want you to try your best to emotionally manipulate me into into really, like getting on your side. Like tiny, tiny violins pull all the heart strings. What is the emotional argument for New Girl? Something that, like, deeply resonates with you.

 

Candice Lim  30:38

So when I think about this show. I think I love it, because the show encapsulates all the things that I’m missing from my adult life. I will note that, like I said, I watched new girl when I was still on, and I was like, high school or so, and so this show was kind of like a projection of, like, what my 20s might be what my early 30s might be. And I think at the time, I was like, This sounds like such a great deal. You know, this is such a yes and crew. They all wake up and they’re just like, hey, does anyone have like, an enemy we need to fight? Does anyone have a job they need to get back? Does anyone have like, an adult school Creative Writing student they need to investigate? And I like that. They all would just jump up and go. And I think that’s what I wish I could have in my adult life now, like, I would be interested in some chaos where I can, like, wake up on a Saturday, have no plans, jump into a Ford Flex, and then just, like, get up to some crazy stuff, that mischief. Of like, I don’t know where we’re going, but I’m going with you, that spontaneity. I crave it in a very Schmidt way.

 

Aminatou Sow  31:42

Okay, Ronald, your turn. What’s the emotional argument for a community like something that really resonates with you?

 

Speaker 1  31:49

I think watching this show, the fact that you go on there and they really try to represent everyone. And at first you could look in there and say every race is represented in the show. But I think what’s more important is when I think about the fact that I’m a 39 year old man, and if I were to go to Greendale Community College, I could be best friends with a 25 year old person, and we could together be trying to conquer our dreams. We could both be going for the same thing, or something that was similar to one another, and be side by side and doing it. And there’s such a diversity of thought there. There’s such an opportunity for me to learn from them and them to learn from me and all of these different ways. And as someone who kind of restarted their career at age 34 I could have easily been at a community college, I could have been in there taking classes, knowing that as an adult, there’s all these different levels of you figuring it out over and over and over again, and they’re all in one place. They’re all place figuring it out together. I think that’s the beauty of community college, and that’s the beauty of community.

 

Aminatou Sow  32:59

Wow, all of the tear drops on the guitar for Ronald. That is, I was like, there’s a policy argument for Community College. There’s the emotional resonance of restarting the career. This is this, this show is taking me places that I did not expect I would be going today. So I’m feeling, I’m feeling a little shook. Okay, we’re moving into round four, which is our lightning round so quick answers. Give me yes or no’s one liners. That’s where we’re going today. Ronald did community do for community college? What Ryan Gosling did for jazz musicians with La La Land?

 

Ronald young Jr.  33:39

God no.

 

Aminatou Sow  33:42

Do not elaborate. Thank you. Candice, which Schmidt pronunciation has stuck with you? More Lady Gaga or Chutney and or is there a third option that you would like to share with us?

 

Speaker 2  33:56

There’s a third option. It’s when he says a white man, typical.

 

Aminatou Sow  34:00

Thank you. Ronald, in community, there’s a course guide with classes like Nicolas Cage, good or bad. What course from community do you want to take the most?

 

Speaker 1  34:11

Who’s the boss? That’s the examination of Angela and Tony.

 

Aminatou Sow  34:16

Yeah, love Candice, in the spirit of true American the nonsensical drinking game that the cast of New Girl played throughout the seasons, I want you to name as many American presidents as you can in 10 seconds, go.

 

Candice  34:29

George, Washington, John Adams, Abraham Lincoln, John F Kennedy, Nixon, Reagan, Obama, Clinton, Carter, Trump.

 

Aminatou Sow  34:41

That’s it, you what? Why are you so good at this?

 

Candice  34:45

I can tell you why.

 

Aminatou Sow  34:46

Tell me why my brain was frozen.

 

Candice  34:48

When I was in AP US History. For extra credit, my teacher made us sing the Animaniacs President Song, and if you could sing it from memory, you would get bonus points. So what did I do? I burned it onto a CD, and every single morning in my Honda Civic with my mother, I played that CD constantly on this 10 minute drive.

 

Aminatou Sow  35:12

Millennials, we are not well. Thank you very much. That was amazing. And the Animaniacs, presidents this, thank you. Thank you. No problem. Okay, team, we are now in our final round. I this is, this has been really hard. I really I’m gonna tell you, I think I told you this already. I walked in here feeling very confident of where this was gonna go for me, and instead, I just am having these very cozy feelings for 2009 which is also weird. It’s like, also a weird journey to be taken in. Um, before we get to the final round, though, I want to do something a little needling for both of you. What would you tell someone who wanted to watch the other person show to discourage them to watch it. You’re like, hey, maybe this is not the best use of your time today to watch new girl. Like, what’s that argument.

 

Speaker 1  36:08

That the show is called New Girl and it’s based around Jess and she is the most annoying character of the show. She is the Achilles heel of the show. You can replace her with someone just as vanilla, but all of the big characters around her are doing the work. So if you’re watching the show and you’re subject to watching any of her plot lines, it’s not really that fun, except for the fact that she ends up with Nick.

 

Aminatou Sow  36:31

Wow, brutal Candice. What’s that argument?

 

Candice  36:35

Pierce is there. He is in your Spanish class. He is in your cafeteria, eating your chicken tenders. No Pierce on campus. Pierce is out. Louise Guzman is in.

 

Aminatou Sow  36:50

I mean, Louise Guzman is in. Works for so many things, like, I’m like, can Luis Guzman be in here? That would be amazing today. Okay, back to regular, scheduled programming. So we are everybody has 30 seconds uninterrupted to make the case for why your show has the best hang. It’s our final round. You are neck and neck. Ronald, state your case for the ensemble of community being the best hang in television land.

 

Speaker 1  37:28

Do you want to go to a place where you belong and you don’t have to change anything about yourself? You just show up and you’re already ready to go. There’s friends that are built in for you. They’re chasing their dreams just like you, and you’re gonna have a good time, and you’re gonna get to your goals, you should go to Greendale Community College and hang out with the students of Greendale.

 

Aminatou Sow  37:47

Wow, dang, it had everything. It was like the voice dropped an octave, didn’t even need the whole time. And, you know, like, impassion, wow, okay, Candace, that’s the, you know, that’s the plea to beat. Do you think you can do it? I think you can do it. Let’s see okay, all yours.

 

Speaker 2  38:10

Do you like to have fun without leaving the comfort of your home? Do you like Damon Wayans Jr? Do you love Jake Johnson and minks? Well, let me tell you the OG Jake Johnson was here because let me ask you a question, do you actually like your friends right now? Like, really think about it. Do you have any friends from college who, like, grew up and now you have to live in the real world, and you kind of hate them, but you also can’t leave them. And it’s like, what if I could bring in new friends, and what if we could have fun and not talk about work, but instead hang out our bar every day, and the bartender is actually my roommate, and so he gives us free drinks, and we just make fun of other people, but also love each other and break down the tenets of toxic masculinity. If you like that, if you want a good hang and you want someone to have boba with, I think New Girl is a place to be, especially when you are not married and don’t have kids like myself.

 

Aminatou Sow  38:59

Round of applause for both of you that was amazing. Y’all. This is really hard. I did not think it was gonna be hard, which is such a testament to like, both of you, and what a fun hang you both are like, I just had, I just had a blast. So thanks for being a good hang anytime.

 

Ronald young Jr.  39:15

Thanks for having us.

 

Aminatou Sow  39:17

Okay, I’m going through my notes. This is really, really, really, hard. I hate to pick winners, but I’m gonna say this and for and I’m gonna say the reason why, Ronald, you are the winner of today’s episode. I know Candice, you feel betrayed, but walk with me. Walk with me. I know it feels like such a betrayal, because here is my reason, and I feel that, as a reasonable person, you might agree. I remember watching community like live, as it was on the air, like it was appointment television, and then kind of the conversation around the show, like the Fandom of the show, made it like a. Oh, I don’t know that I want to have this much discourse about something that I just enjoy all the time. So I just think that Ronald’s like, you know, like it was such a one, it was such a hard place to come back for for me, like it felt a little more challenging. But I think that, like, your points about the winningness of Community College and the cast like that, just like, gave me a lot of like, fuzzy feelings, in a way that I was like, oh yeah, this is TV at its best, like it really is. And also, I have to say that your argument about like, Pierce definitely like, problematic, bad person. But also that, like, we do need to see that perspective, and that perspective was pushed on like, a lot, like, no one in the cast, like, agrees that it’s like a delight to have him around. I was like, Oh yeah, that was addressed, like, in the way that the discourse dismissed a lot at the time. But also, yeah, I just gotta say, I love to have my mind change about something. So for that alone, I will make you today’s winner. But I have to say it was very hard. And also, um, New Girl is the perfect television show so.

 

Candice Lim  41:03

Thank you.

 

Aminatou Sow  41:04

It’s not a, you know, this was not a walk in the park.

 

Ronald young Jr.  41:06

Thank you.

 

Candice Lim  41:07

I mean, here’s the thing, I did call myself a delusional lizard, so take that at fact. But I respect you, Ronald, I think you have great taste, and so I am willing to bow to the sword of community, even though, I guess we revealed that you guys are Pierce defenders. Interesting, no one is defending.

 

Speaker 1  41:32

From the person defending. Zoe de Chanel, who terrorized us with Ukulele.

 

Candice Lim  41:38

I mean, terrorized? How many times can you do?

 

Aminatou Sow  41:46

Everyone’s microphone. This is where I cut everyone’s microphone, and it’s why millennials are not allowed to have debate about anything. Thank you. Thank you both for being here today. This was so fun, and I really appreciate it.

 

Candice Lim  42:02

Thank you so much.

 

Ronald young Jr.  42:02

Thank you, it’s been great.

 

Aminatou Sow  42:08

Thanks again to Candice Lim and Ronald Young Jr, for bringing their beautiful brains onto the show, and thanks to everyone for listening. If you have a strongly held pop culture conviction and you want to hear it debated on the show, let us know in the review section, and if you want to hear more of Candice and Ronald, check out Candice’s podcast ICYMI and Ronald’s new podcast, Wait For It. We’ll be back next week.

 

CREDITS  42:32

There’s more Pop Culture Debate Club with Lemonada Premium subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content like Carl Tart and Lamar Woods from the best sports movie episode talking about working at Madame Tussaud’s Wax Museum. Subscribe now in Apple podcasts.  Pop Culture Debate Club is a production of Lemonada and the BBC.  I’m Aminatou Sow the show is produced by me, Joanna Solotaroff, Kryssy Pease, Lamar Wood and Dani Matias. Our mix is by Noah Smith. Rachel Neel is VP of new content. Our SVP of weekly content is Steve Nelson. Commissioning editor for the BBC is Rhian Roberts. Executive Producers are Stephanie Wittels Wachs and Jessica Cordova Kramer.  Follow Pop Culture Debate Club, wherever you get your podcasts.