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Who is the worst fictional American abroad in pop culture? Two comedians square off this week and try to convince Aminatou Sow that their pick should be barred from international travel. Solomon Georgio wants to ban Indiana Jones from leaving America while David Gborie thinks it’s Deuce Bigalow who needs to stay Stateside. Solomon says Indy steals antiquities and didn’t stop Nazis when he had multiple chances. David isn’t a fan of Deuce’s homophobic language and use of racial stereotypes. Ultimately, Aminatou Sow must revoke one passport and declare the worst fictional American abroad.

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Transcript

SPEAKERS

David Gborie, Aminatou Sow, Solomon Georgio

Aminatou Sow  00:00

Hi, I’m Aminatou Sow, and I’m a writer who loves pop culture. So welcome to Pop Culture Debate Club from Lemonada and the BBC. We bring on some of the funniest, smartest folks in the biz to go head to head over TV, music and movies that we love. And because I’m the judge, I get to choose the winner. Today, we’re going big and discussing something that is very near and dear to my heart, and something I unsurprisingly have a lot of feelings about depictions of fictional Americans abroad, specifically, who is the worst among them in pop culture, and here with me today to break it down, is stand up comedian and television writer Solomon Georgio and comedian writer and voice actor, David Borey, welcome to the show.

 

Aminatou Sow  00:56

Solomon, David, thanks for joining me today before we get into it. Can you tell me what your relationship to these United States is? David, maybe you go first.

 

David Gborie  01:07

Okay.

 

Aminatou Sow  01:09

We’re doing long form birth certificate here podcasts.

 

David Gborie  01:13

That’s the proof. That’s great, because my birth certificate is oriented vertical. For some reason it feels fake.

 

Aminatou Sow  01:21

Is it under your mom’s bed, though, is the real question, because I think where is it?

 

David Gborie  01:26

Last we found it. It was in a stack of old US West phone bills from the 90s. Hoarder is a word that I don’t like to use, but she keeps stuff.

 

Aminatou Sow  01:40

It’s called collecting and archiving. Please have some respect.

 

David Gborie  01:45

Collecting makes it seem like you could flip it for money later. We just have a lot of old essence magazines. I guess my relationship, first generation from Sierra Leone, first in my family to be born here.

 

Aminatou Sow  02:04

What about you, Solomon?

 

Solomon Georgio  02:06

My birth certificate is mostly vibes and my mom’s guests. Yeah, I was born a dirt floor in an African country, okay.

 

Aminatou Sow  02:17

But here’s my question, where you leave the states and you see other Americans, are you associating with them, or are you disassociating with them? It’s like, what’s the deal?

 

David Gborie  02:26

I’m Canadian, as soon as we leave the border.

 

Solomon Georgio  02:32

Yeah, I personally try not to associate with anybody, with people in the country, people from America. Like, it’s like, I’m the kind of person that wants to go see shit and not say anything out loud for a long time, right?

 

Aminatou Sow  02:42

Okay, well, Solomon, what fictional American abroad did you choose to talk about today?

 

Solomon Georgio  02:48

Indiana motherfucking Jones.

 

Aminatou Sow  02:51

Okay, for the seven people who don’t know who Indiana Jones is, can you briefly explain who he is?

 

Solomon Georgio  02:59

The best way to explain who he is, he is in a professor who gets rambly called to do a archeological adventure, which, if is like, it’s just him, just going on adventures where he does nothing to help any situations, other than to steal something.

 

Aminatou Sow  03:16

Okay, there are five Indiana Jones films out there. Is there a particular one that you’re going to be stressing in today’s debate, or are we talking about the larger Indiana Jones universe?

 

Solomon Georgio  03:29

If you think there’s a big difference between from one movie to the next movie, you have been lying to yourself in regards to the Indiana Jones lore.

 

Aminatou Sow  03:38

So he doesn’t get woke her. It’s like he used to steal stuff, and then by five he’s like, returning things. Okay,

 

Solomon Georgio  03:43

good, yeah, no, it’s all put in a fucking warehouse that is never touched.

 

Aminatou Sow  03:47

Yeah, British Museum style. Okay, good to know. Good to know. David, who are you going with today?

 

David Gborie  03:52

So granted, when I picked this, I had not seen it, and then I went back and re watched I had not seen it for years. I’m picking Deuce, Bigelow, European Gigolo.

 

Aminatou Sow  04:04

Wow okay, I guess you win like already. Show is done. Well, there’s also the original Deuce Bigelow, male gigolo, can you give me a brief summary for you know, the millions of people who don’t know who Deuce biggle is and how he finds himself in Europe.

 

David Gborie  04:24

I mean, outside of the title, he’s a male gigolo. Oh, there’s a crime committed in America, and he has to leave to kind of like, dodge the heat. They frame him for something. So he goes to Europe to meet his great friend, TJ, played by Eddie Griffin, who is accused of killing all the European gigolos. Deuce Bigelow has to help clear his friend’s name by gigolo ing abroad.

 

Aminatou Sow  04:58

The layers of just problems and problematicness.

 

David Gborie  05:03

Oh, it’s crazy.

 

Aminatou Sow  05:05

Is this the first thing that you’d like the minute when we pitched you this, where you were like, I know exactly who I’m going with. Or did you have to give it some thought?

 

David Gborie  05:11

Well, I picked King Ralph first. Do you guys remember that?

 

Solomon Georgio  05:14

Oh, yes.

 

David Gborie  05:17

I picked King Ralph. And then I was like, Oh, I had seen that like in the last couple years. Let me pick Deuce Piccolo, because I think I saw it when it came out. So I was, I think I was in high school when that movie came out, so I was like, oh, it’d be a fun re watch. And I know that it’s Rob Schneider, so it’s gonna be corny. And, uh, yeah, it’s a movie.

 

Aminatou Sow  05:38

Okay, and Solomon Indiana Jones was your top choice, or did you have other content?

 

Solomon Georgio  05:42

Right to it. It was so easy. I’ve hated that man for 30 years.

 

Aminatou Sow  05:46

Okay, that’s perfect, and you’re both familiar with each other’s picks, right? Like you, like you’ve seen each other’s like movies, okay, great.

 

David Gborie  05:54

I even saw the Shia LaBeouf one.

 

Solomon Georgio  05:57

Oh, Crystal Skull.

 

David Gborie  06:00

At the end, or whatever.

 

Aminatou Sow  06:02

I’m screaming. Okay, let’s get into it. This is round one. The rules are as follows. It’s pretty easy here. Your mission is to win me over with your thoughts and your takes, especially your hot takes, as to why your picks today fully embodies the worst fictional American abroad. I gotta say, I really thought this was going to be an Emily in Paris versus, um, what’s his name, Ted Lasso, because in the modern era, to me, those are like the most two diabolical American villains we have in the modern era.

 

David Gborie  06:35

I’ve never seen Emily, but I hate Ted lasso.

 

Aminatou Sow  06:39

Emily is like, Emily is diabolical, you know, because there are those Americans that they go overseas and they pretend that they’re nice, you know, which is really, which is what they all do. But I’m just like, this is and the fact that, like everybody buys into it, really drives me nuts.

 

Solomon Georgio  06:54

Isn’t she like Phil Collins, daughter?

 

Aminatou Sow  06:56

Yes, see, that’s an issue.

 

Solomon Georgio  06:58

I can’t hate on Phil Collins by association.

 

Aminatou Sow  07:01

I know, I can’t hate on Phil Collins. Also it, you know, separate the art from the artists, yeah.

 

Solomon Georgio  07:06

I just probably never gonna watch the show. So I can never like.

 

Aminatou Sow  07:11

Okay, well, David, can you please make your opening argument for deuce, Bigelow, American Gigolo and why it should win today’s debate.

 

David Gborie  07:21

Well, here’s my opening argument. I am you said it’s okay to have a hot take. I’m going to start with a hot take. I think that Deuce Bigelow European Gigolo is actually the best of us. I think he’s one of the better tourists that Americans have ever had depicted on film, in a movie rife with problematic behavior. Somehow, deuce Bigelow stands above it all and remains untarnished. And to me, he is who you want to have visiting from the US delegate. That’s how I feel.

 

Aminatou Sow  08:00

Okay, okay, Solomon, it’s your turn. Same basic idea. Why do you think Indiana Jones should win today?

 

Solomon Georgio  08:08

Simply put, we are talking about somebody who’s only committed theft has multiple opportunities to stop Nazis and has fully not taken down their army. Every time he’s had a person of color assistant, they’re always on the verge of death or have died. He also did not know he had a son into that child was well into his 20s, and simply put, Indiana Jones is the worst kind of person being your country. Watch all your stuff. He will take it.

 

Aminatou Sow  08:35

Wow, okay, let’s take a quick break. Thank you for that.

 

Aminatou Sow  08:54

Okay, we’re back now that I have a little bit of background on your picks. The next round is all about the impassioned argument, and it’s clear to me that both of these men care very deeply about their careers. Solomon, do you think that Indiana Jones gives archeologists a bad name?

 

Solomon Georgio  09:12

No, absolutely not. It’s a field that should not exist. It is people literally just grave digging.

 

Aminatou Sow  09:18

Professional like.

 

Solomon Georgio  09:20

Like, we have a good source of history of what we have in this world. And these people are just going, like, Look, I get it. There’s some things that they do find that’s very helpful and preserve a lot of great things. But in general, it’s usually a competition to get something to your country that belongs to another country, to a group of people that still usually exist. So yeah, it’s if so some of you guys are great. Some of them are bad. But I think he definitely brings it up to another level, because he makes them try to look cool, because this makes it looks like an adventure. And in all honesty, they’re not that cool. They don’t do that much. It’s mostly digging a hole, looking at a thing, and going, nice.

 

Aminatou Sow  09:57

Man, now I really want to go and just read to. See how the archeology community handled the summer of 2020, like, I want to know what all their fake woke stuff was about. Because when you put it that way, I’m like, yeah, this is sus everything.

 

Solomon Georgio  10:11

It’s like, it’s one thing. It’s like, it’s preserving it and like making it like, like, exists again, and like cleaning it up and keeping it there. And I’m assuming a lot of them do that. It’s just the amount of times where it’s like that was not over here until recently.

 

Aminatou Sow  10:26

Okay, David Deuce Bigelow, is he a disgrace to the gigolo community?

 

David Gborie  10:31

Oh, I mean the Gigolo community, as we all know, very complicated.

 

Aminatou Sow  10:41

Unlike the archeology community, where it’s like, straightforward, what happens there?

 

David Gborie  10:45

I mean, well, one is a science, one is an art. I’ll let you pick. Draw your own conclusions. I actually think that he is I think that I appreciate Deuce piccolo because his approach to gig, gig lowing, giggleizing?

 

Aminatou Sow  11:05

Both work you guys more natural, but I’m not an expert, so I can’t tell you.

 

David Gborie  11:13

His approach to giggleizing Is he tries to get to the root of the problem for The customers in that oftentimes it’s a loneliness issue, it’s a self confidence issue, it’s something like that. I mean, yeah, he’ll sex you up, but he wants to sex your mind as well. And I think that that is beautiful, and I appreciate him for that.

 

Solomon Georgio  11:35

I think that it’s a great definition of art meeting science.

 

Aminatou Sow  11:48

I hate both of you so much. I’m so angry that I’m laughing with you not.

 

David Gborie  11:57

Okay, think about that. Yeah, we don’t help each other at all.

 

Aminatou Sow  12:04

It’s like the mind is hell. Okay with these impassioned arguments still very top of mind. I want to talk about your characters in terms of the amount of damage that they’re leaving in their wakes. So Indiana Jones, known for triggering ancient booby traps, pilfering priceless treasures, shooting a guy in broad daylight, also travels with a whip problematic.

 

Solomon Georgio  12:34

What never used for the purpose of not like.

 

Aminatou Sow  12:37

Whip is such a strong you know, I’m just like, that’s a choice for a weapon that is, it’s evocative of things I don’t like.

 

Solomon Georgio  12:43

A rope makes sense, but a whip?

 

David Gborie  12:46

It’s the worst weapon to see in public. I saw a guy in the park, god damn it, Denver. I saw a guy in the park recently whipping alone, and it was like.

 

Aminatou Sow  12:58

I’m not understanding. He’s in the park and he has a whip, and he’s just cracking a whip at nobody in particular.

 

David Gborie  13:04

I feel like it was some type of he was training for some type of performance, because it was very.

 

Aminatou Sow  13:09

What kind of performance involves a whip?

 

David Gborie  13:11

I don’t get invited to those parties, thank God. But it felt like it was very, it didn’t seem like he was doing it for accuracy. It seemed like he was doing it for form, type of a situation, but I saw it at the park. I was riding my bike, and I was telling my buddy I was riding bikes with I was like, I would rather see a gun in public. I would rather that 100 because I’ve seen that before. I know what to do with that. Let’s get out of here whipping.

 

Aminatou Sow  13:42

I  just also feel like a gun it, you know, like, there’s the fakeness of, like, Oh, you got to get a background check, you know? Like, I know that it’s all fake, but at least I’m like, Okay, we’ve, like, we have fake regulation of these weapons, a whip. I’m like, where? Why does that even enter your imagination, that that’s something you could walk around with.

 

David Gborie  14:00

You could buy a whip at the fair.

 

Solomon Georgio  14:02

Look I understand the point you guys are trying to make, but I’m more afraid of a gun. A rip has a radius.

 

Aminatou Sow  14:11

Fine Solomon, I guess when you put it that way and you use your whole brain, fine, but anyway, you know, like you meet a stranger and he has a whip and the carry on. It’s not okay, you know what I mean.

 

David Gborie  14:25

So travel that’s, that’s not, that’s not diabolical. It’s whack. I hate it.

 

Aminatou Sow  14:31

I guess, like Solomon, I just want you to make a strong argument to me for why Indiana Jones should get to keep his passport at all. Because Why is he traveling with a whip?

 

Solomon Georgio  14:40

You know what? Honestly, keeping brown people on their toes is kind of nice.

 

Aminatou Sow  14:46

You think we’re not on our toes enough, like a reminder.

 

Solomon Georgio  14:49

Sometimes, if we get relaxed, terrible things happen, like joy.

 

Aminatou Sow  14:55

Like one time I relaxed, and then it all fell apart.

 

Solomon Georgio  14:59

Like, it all really, like. Like I was zenned out, and truly I could have died. Yeah, there’s, like, look, I guess there are a few benefits to him having his passport. He’s, he definitely, like, he’s, he’s at least entertaining at dinners, like they’re my favorite scenes in every one of those movies. Is him having a good time with whoever he’s about to steal from. And he’s like, he takes a risk. He monkey brains, and one in one of the movies was it, did it feel racist that they were eating monkey brains? Absolutely, but it didn’t stop him. He ate it.

 

Aminatou Sow  15:36

The Ebola implications of that.

 

Solomon Georgio  15:38

At least he takes the risks a lot of white tours, did not take any risks. Like, he like, he’ll like, he’s afraid of snakes, but he still would put his hand in a pit of snakes. So, you know.

 

David Gborie  15:48

I love that. He’s not going to Sandals Jamaica, no, he’s going to Trench Town, yeah, going.

 

Solomon Georgio  15:53

To Sam Anthony Bourdain, the trip, uh, he’s gonna try the food the locals are trying. Are eating like, he’s not backing away.

 

Aminatou Sow  16:01

Sandal like sandals, Jamaica, stop. Well, you know, so Indiana Jones definitely known for, you know, his list of international crimes, but I feel like the inverse is probably true for Deuce Bigelow. David, what were Deuce Bigalows real crimes other than breaking hearts and putting female pleasure first?

 

David Gborie  16:20

I don’t think the second one is a crime.

 

Aminatou Sow  16:22

No, I agree.

 

David Gborie  16:23

Let it be known. I there were no real crimes. There were no real crimes. He came, he he helped the Union. He stopped a killer, he freed an American war criminal, not war criminal, but an American criminal. I don’t think he did. If he stimulated the local economy, he came, he was willing to work for the country, as well as putting his money back into the country via restaurants and all kinds of things. I don’t think he did anything wrong. If anything, we should give passports to Bigelow in all Bigelow progeny going forward, I think that they could be a great force.

 

Aminatou Sow  16:56

Bigelow progeny just sent like chills down my spine. It’s giving. It’s giving 90 day fiance.

 

David Gborie  17:05

Well, it’s also, I used to dance under that name, but that’s a whole different life.

 

Aminatou Sow  17:09

Wow, you really buried the lead there. Excuse me.

 

David Gborie  17:14

No, that was a joke, but I do. I think that, yeah, I think that he should. I think he’s only done good. I think he leads with positive intent. I don’t think he comes to do any harm, and he doesn’t. I think at least, at least Amsterdam was better for having had him there.

 

Aminatou Sow  17:33

Okay, well, but I want you to make the opposite case now for why his passport should be revoked. What was he doing that we need to take the passport away for.

 

David Gborie  17:42

I mean, he’s a passport, bro.

 

Solomon Georgio  17:46

I’m sorry, but adultery is a crime. Yet, shouldn’t it be like.

 

David Gborie  17:49

No, his wife was dead. She died. He was traveling with her prosthetic leg.

 

Solomon Georgio  17:56

Uh, he’s cheating the women that are married to men who that’s do?

 

David Gborie  18:01

We can’t, you can’t put that on him. Solomon, it’s a two it’s a two column.

 

Solomon Georgio  18:05

That’s a two person. God, he’s traveling to different like, he’s also a businessman. He’s an he’s very good at he’s very good at reading people. He’s very good at learning about women’s pleasures and things. He also knows that they’re married.

 

David Gborie  18:18

And he didn’t have sex with a lot of those women. He just helped them fix their lives.

 

Solomon Georgio  18:22

Emotional, there’s emotional sex and there’s physical sex and.

 

David Gborie  18:27

People’s arrangements. I don’t know these people.

 

Aminatou Sow  18:31

We don’t make judgments here on pop culture Debate Club.

 

Solomon Georgio  18:34

We can obviously honor people’s honor people’s commitments, and see, see if they’re making the right decision for themselves.

 

David Gborie  18:39

What if they were open, what if they were poly and what if they weren’t?

 

Solomon Georgio  18:42

What if they weren’t okay?

 

Aminatou Sow  18:44

I want to shift I want to shift gears a little bit. I want to shift gears a little bit to something semi serious. We’re never really serious here. When you re examine your picks through that. You know, you look at it with the 2024, eyes. What like really jumps out at you as being intensely bad or something that doesn’t sit right, or like, what’s problematic? David, you go first.

 

David Gborie  19:06

The language, just like it was funny, because I remember it is being a kind of mild silly movie. And then you go back and watch it, and it’s just like hate speech and like, like, just the references that they have for gay people and things like that, where you’re like, this was a mainstream this was, like, a funny movie for kids to go see. You know what I mean. So, like, really, just how far views in all of that stuff, and what is acceptable and how to speak about groups is really come a long way, and it’s been like, 19 years that movie came out. No five so, yeah, the language was really, when you watch it, it’s kind of off putting, you know what I mean.

 

Aminatou Sow  19:47

Where you’re like, I mean, like, down to the down to the title, you know, it’s just like, it’s the, yeah, it’s like, the sex worker talk, the homophobia, the it’s, I rewatch it this weekend, and I. Like, oh, yeah, I, like, my parents had no business letting us have this movie on, you know, like, what it was, why wild?

 

David Gborie  20:06

Or even, like, the Asian stereotypes, which were like, wow, they caught it straight for no reason. Like, it just was like, yeah, it was just so loaded. It was just so so loaded. And that’s like, tough to see, because it was loaded in a way where it was like, not even to serve the greater. It’s not a funny movie, not like you even watch it and you have those laughs where you’re like, I shouldn’t be laughing, but that is hilarious. You’re like, no, you just said that shit. Didn’t laugh at all. So yeah, just the overall tone and all the language of the movie was like.

 

Aminatou Sow  20:43

What a bummer. What about you, Solomon?

 

Solomon Georgio  20:47

There’s plenty of points to those movies that don’t apply today, like, well and both, but for me, it’s like the way he treats women, the way he literally ignored his own son, the way he again, he had two opportunities to infiltrate and take down the Nazis and only cause the tiny, the tinnitus, amount of damage to the army, and left with an important artifact from another country. Like, he had, like, two genuine moments to fully take down the Nazis. And he truly was like, yeah, I’m good. I just needed this skull.

 

Aminatou Sow  21:22

That just feels like straight up commentary on American military imperialism. It’s just like, oh, that’s what we do, like, mission focused. Yeah, we’re getting this one thing, the skull, but let everything else fall apart. That’s not our problem.

 

Solomon Georgio  21:37

But no, it’s just, yeah, he’s, he was a misogynist. He just like, he like, he didn’t like him and his dad, like, honestly, I blame his father. They had a terrible relationship as well. If you’ve watched the Last Crusade, that’s Sean Connery. Sean Connery, Connie was his dad, his terrible father, who also didn’t pay attention to him. So he’s like, it’s a cycle of violence of men that keeps going on, and he’s dad did to him, and he’s gonna and he brought forth to his son in the final movie. So it’s, yeah, fuck him forever.

 

David Gborie  22:08

Hurt people.

 

Aminatou Sow  22:08

Wow, I’m so here for the I’m so here for the message of this podcast is like, we need involved fathers. We have positive, involved fathers, and then we don’t have these men walking around the globe just making doing damage.

 

Solomon Georgio  22:20

Yeah, it’s that generational trauma to blame colonialism that that’s how it was created. Bad dads.

 

Aminatou Sow  22:26

That’s right, bad dad. Next thing you know, you’re just like cracking a whip in the park in Denver by yourself. There’s been direct lines about shirtless. Let’s take another break.

 

Aminatou Sow  22:52

Okay, we’re back now. It’s time for our lightning round. I’m gonna ask you both a series of questions about your picks, and I want you to answer them as quickly and as honestly as possible. Here we go. Solomon, who is the bigger himbo, Indiana Jones or Deuce Bigelow?

 

Solomon Georgio  23:07

Deuce Bigelow.

 

Aminatou Sow  23:09

David, same question. Who’s the bigger himbo, Deuce Bigelow or Indiana Jones?

 

David Gborie  23:12

Indiana Jones, Deuce is a businessman.

 

Aminatou Sow  23:16

Solomon, is there anything you hate as much as Indiana Jones famously hates snakes.

 

Solomon Georgio  23:24

Outside.

 

Aminatou Sow  23:27

Tough, David Mike Mitchell, the guy who directed the first use Bigelow film, recently said, I think it’s time for Rob Schneider to mentor a younger man whore and carry on the tradition. What up and coming actor would you like to see take over the deuce Bigelow franchise, if we would ever allow it to happen?

 

David Gborie  23:46

Timothy Chalamet.

 

Aminatou Sow  23:48

Wow, Solomon in Indiana Jones and the dial of destiny. The big arc of the film has to do with going back in time to kill Hitler. If you had access to a time machine and Hitler is presumably dead already, what would you go back in time to do or fix?

 

Solomon Georgio  24:03

But Hitler’s already dead.

 

Aminatou Sow  24:05

Yeah, Hitler’s already dead.

 

Solomon Georgio  24:06

I’d bring Hitler back to life.

 

Aminatou Sow  24:09

Moving on, David, just kidding. I don’t know why you answered that again. No, I’d probably be like, do it for the plot.

 

Solomon Georgio  24:22

God, that’s tough to say. Stop the colonization of every African country.

 

Aminatou Sow  24:28

Fine, fair. David Deuce Bigelow, European Gigolo was primarily filmed in Amsterdam. Schneider said that he first realized that the film would not turn out well when his crew arrived completely high and kept using, quote, irresponsible amounts of marijuana during much of the shoot. My question is, is there such a thing as an irresponsible amount of weed, and what does that look like?

 

David Gborie  24:51

Yeah, of course.

 

Aminatou Sow  24:52

Yeah, of course.

 

David Gborie  24:54

I’d say anything more than two blunts in a day is probably vision it.

 

Aminatou Sow  24:58

Two blunts in a day is more than a. Strong hearted. I’m like, what do you mean two blunts?

 

David Gborie  25:03

I have the heart of a lion.

 

Solomon Georgio  25:05

You’ll be swaying me off the ceiling if I did two blunts in one day.

 

David Gborie  25:11

It also depends on your day. But yeah, there’s an irresponsible.

 

Aminatou Sow  25:20

Okay, Solomon, who said it Indiana Jones or Deuce Bigelow? Martini Two olives.

 

Solomon Georgio  25:27

Deuce Bigolow?

 

Aminatou Sow  25:28

Deuce Bigelow. If this film is to be believed, a martini in 1999 costs $8.50?

 

David Gborie  25:34

50 cents on the cocktail huh?

 

Aminatou Sow  25:38

I know, very weird.

 

Solomon Georgio  25:40

I don’t remember getting quarters at the bar.

 

David Gborie  25:42

Oh, but I was down bad. I didn’t know other people were doing.

 

Aminatou Sow  25:46

Noth of your cities. Though, how much do you think you’re spending on one drink when you go out? Like, what’s the standard drink price?

 

David Gborie  25:53

Like a mixed drink? I think it’s.

 

Aminatou Sow  25:55

Yeah, like a cocktail.

 

David Gborie  25:57

Like a craft cocktail, it could be up to 10-12?

 

Aminatou Sow  26:01

10?

 

David Gborie  26:02

Yeah, they have some crazy cocktail place.

 

Aminatou Sow  26:05

New York City, 20 something dollars. Okay, what’s it? What’s happening in LA?

 

Solomon Georgio  26:12

I’m honestly, I’m too wealthy to check my tab, but I’m assuming.

 

Aminatou Sow  26:16

You just called both of them.

 

Solomon Georgio  26:21

But I’ll let me, if I looked it up, I think it’s usually between like 12, $13?

 

Aminatou Sow  26:27

Oh my gosh.

 

David Gborie  26:28

That feels right for it. New York is nuts to drinking.

 

Aminatou Sow  26:31

I gotta move.

 

Solomon Georgio  26:32

I stick to like, Tito’s. And Tito’s is usually, I’ve never spent more than like, 15 bucks in a drink at the bar. I also don’t do cocktails.

 

Aminatou Sow  26:39

Fair enough, okay, David, who said it Indiana Jones or Deuce Bigelow? It’s not the years, honey. It’s the mileage.

 

David Gborie  26:47

Indiana Jones.

 

Aminatou Sow  26:48

I know, even though it sounds like it should come out of Deuce Bigelow’s mouth, right?

 

David Gborie  26:51

That’s what I’m trying to say. Deuce is a sweet guy. He’s the everybody else is bad.

 

Solomon Georgio  26:57

He wouldn’t say honey, like that. I don’t think he would.

 

Aminatou Sow  27:00

Is a sweet guy. Is like he yeah, those allegations will not stick all the time, but I hear you. Okay. Solomon, which baby name do you think is ranked higher in 2024? Deuce or Indiana?

 

Solomon Georgio  27:16

I bet it’s Indiana.

 

Aminatou Sow  27:18

No, Deuce ranks number 866 of popular boy naming their child.

 

David Gborie  27:25

Everything Indiana.

 

Aminatou Sow  27:28

You say, what do you want to take a shit you’re naming your kid deuce. Indiana has ranked like 3464 it’s like not even close.

 

David Gborie  27:37

To be fair, in my house, we say, I’m gonna take an Indiana.

 

Aminatou Sow  27:44

This is what’s happening in real America. We just like, haven’t checked in, but this is what’s happening.

 

David Gborie  27:48

Yeah, have you guys been to Indiana recently? […]

 

Aminatou Sow  27:50

I don’t have any business down there. No, thanks.

 

Solomon Georgio  27:54

Like, if I walk in a room and yell, deuce and five people turn their heads, I’m […]

 

Aminatou Sow  28:01

Okay, David, based on names alone, if you met someone named Deuce or Indiana, who’s the bigger asshole?

 

David Gborie  28:08

Indiana, I’ve known a kid named deuce. He’s pretty nice.

 

Aminatou Sow  28:11

Okay, what about you, Solomon?

 

Solomon Georgio  28:14

It’s a tough call, because it’s a lot to live up to. Probably say Indiana.

 

Aminatou Sow  28:21

Tough, all around. Okay, that concludes our lightning round. I really hate to have to wrap this up, but the time has come. I need to declare a winner at some point. Um, you both have 30 ish uninterrupted seconds to state your case as to who is the worst fictional American abroad. You’re allowed to take swipes at the other person’s character, Indiana Jones, or Deuce Bigelow, I’m gonna go with you. First Solomon state, your final case for Indiana Jones.

 

Solomon Georgio  28:50

Indiana Jones is the worst one period on point blank. Like, what Deuce? We literally have been talking about deuce. Bigelow has not been that bad of a guy. Like, that’s you can’t your argument. Can’t be a counter argument to the actual initial argument. That’s it’s very I’m confused what we’re talking about anymore. So yeah, Indiana Jones, he will always be a domestic terrorist as well as an international terrorist. He’s definitely organized. He has a group of people that give him missions, and I definitely believe he should be in jail and there till the end of time. But no, we still like and also he inspires young white people to be daring risk takers. I go backpacking in like Thailand and get in trouble for, like, smuggling drugs that they didn’t have in their package to begin with. I think it’s a dangerous person to lead by example, and he should definitely be crucified. We should bring that back just for Indiana Jones.

 

Solomon Georgio  28:50

Wow, crucifixion, big, if true. David state, your final case for Deuce Bigelow.

 

David Gborie  28:57

Okay, well, I have said that I do love the guy. I appreciate. Him. Personally, I think that deuce bigalows attitude is wholly American, and that’s what constitutes him as not being a great he goes to a country completely ignorant of the way it works, and decides to intervene in their legal process and solve all their problems and then just leave. That’s the most American thing you could ever do. And I think ultimately we can look at the world and understand that that does not go well often. We cannot have these white men continuing to think they can come to some poor little country, solve their problems and disappear into the night while marrying one of the locals. I think that that is bad, and we can’t. We just can’t have it as nice as he is.

 

Aminatou Sow  30:43

He went to a European country, right? You’re like, small country. And I’m, like, still doing it.

 

David Gborie  30:49

And it’s the Dutch, I don’t know.

 

Solomon Georgio  30:53

Anything they should be.

 

Aminatou Sow  30:54

This is a pretty easy deliberation for me. Deuce Bigelow, is your run of the mill passport, bro? You can cut them off at the State Department, or you can cut them off at JP. Morgan Chase with the credit card, you know? And I think with a little bit, not a little bit, with a lot of therapy, can be a reformed person. Actually, Indiana Jones is like, he’s like an Interpol problem, you know, like, he’s like, a CIA, like, it’s like, nefarious, what’s going on? Yeah, Solomon says we’re bringing crucification.

 

David Gborie  31:32

That’s a crazy end to this.

 

Aminatou Sow  31:35

Because we’re embodying, like, the worst American tradition, which is punishment. You know, it’s just like, yes, like, go for the jugular.

 

Solomon Georgio  31:43

No, I just lock him up. I’m Ethiopian. We invented a lot of these punishments.

 

Aminatou Sow  31:47

And, yeah, that’s, you know, in the old country, like Indiana Jones is, like, he’s like, bad on a foreign policy level, which that is, that machine is hard to stop. So worse American abroad to Indiana Jones. Keep him home, keep him busy. Don’t let him ever leave the land. And there we have it.

 

David Gborie  32:09

All right.

 

CREDITS  32:16

Thanks again to Solomon Georgio and David Gborie. You can find David’s new special Birth of a GNation that’s birth with a G at the beginning on his Patreon, and make sure to check out Solomon’s writing on Survival Of the Thickest.There’s more Pop Culture Debate Club with Lemonada Premium. Subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content like Solomon and David talking about their experiences abroad. Subscribe now in Apple podcasts.  Pop Culture Debate Club is a production of Lemonada and the BBC.  I’m Aminatou Sow the show is produced by me, Joanna Solotaroff, Kryssy Pease, Lamar Wood and Dani Matias. Our mix is by Noah Smith. Rachel Neel is VP of new content. Our SVP of weekly content is Steve Nelson. Commissioning editor for the BBC is Rhian Roberts. Executive Producers are Stephanie Wittels Wachs and Jessica Cordova Kramer.  Follow Pop Culture Debate Club, wherever you get your podcasts.