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Description

During the pandemic, the line between work life and home life got blurry. But that was already true for many people well before COVID-19 arrived. Tamara Taggart was a TV anchor in Canada for 28 years and had a really hard time drawing the line between what she did and who she is. It took suddenly losing that dream job to finally find her true self. This week’s practice is about identity, defining yourself, and staying true to your purpose above all else.

Resources from the show

• Read “When Things Fall Apart: Heart Advice for Difficult Times” by Pema Chodron
• Read “Healing After Job Loss: 100 Practical Ideas” by Alan D. Wolfelt and Kirby J. Duvall
• Try out the 52-Week Inspirational Journal: Find Your Spark: Soul-Searching Prompts and Encouraging Exercises to Get Inspired (A Year of Reflections Journal)

Do you have a question about grief or other ways you can take care of your mental health? Send Claire a question to be featured on an upcoming episode www.bit.ly/newdayask

Want to connect? Join the New Day Facebook Group!  https://www.facebook.com/groups/newdaypod

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Transcript

SPEAKERS

Claire, Tamara Taggart

Claire  00:39

Hi, I’m Claire Bidwell Smith. Welcome to NEW DAY. Have you ever had a moment when you felt like you didn’t know who you were anymore? We talk a lot on this show about what happens when the rug gets pulled out from under us. And that’s because honestly, I can’t think of anyone I know who hasn’t had the experience of unexpected life events of bending the path they thought they were on, or even changing the very way they define themselves. I’ve experienced this with the death of my parents, my divorce, cross country moves, and like everyone else, the pandemic. So today, we’re going to talk about the personal experience of what it means to move through the fallout of significant life changes like these. How do we grieve? How do we let go of an identity we were attached to? How do we persevere when we don’t know what’s ahead. I tapped one of my favorite people to discuss this with because she’s been through it herself more than once. Tamara Taggart is a cancer survivor, mom, veteran broadcaster in a former candidate in the Canadian election, Tamara is married to her musician has been Dave and is a mom of three children. Beckett who has Down Syndrome and two daughters, Zoe and Poppy. Life was hectic but great until 2018. When Tamara’s longtime contract as a news anchor wasn’t renewed. And she had to redefine who she was after she was unexpectedly let go from her job. In our conversation, today, you’re going to hear us talk about how job loss is a form of grief. What it means to redefine yourself, and how to get comfortable in uncertainty. Tamara is funny and smart. And we’ve shared many laughs together while our combined six kids play around us. So I hope you enjoy our conversation as much as we enjoyed having it.

Claire  02:27

Hi, Tamara, welcome to NEW DAY.

Tamara Taggart 

I’m so excited.

Claire 

I’m excited too, I always want to talk to you no matter what. I start every episode of the show by asking my guests how they’re doing. But how are you really doing?

Tamara Taggart

I think that I’m hanging on by a thread most days. All right, it can be honest. Yeah, I know. I know I’m glad good. But don’t we always say that? Good. I’m not good. No, I’m not good. No, it’s tough. Life is tough.

Claire 

How would you describe your life these days? What’s going on? Hmm.

Tamara Taggart 

I feel really, things feel uncertain for me. And they have for a while, a few years for sure. But I think that recently is just watching what’s happening in I’m in Canada. So watching what’s happening here in Canada, I’m, you know, I don’t even have time to see what’s happening anywhere else in the world. Because I feel like things are really tense in my country right now. And really divided. And as a Canadian, I’m not used to that. So it makes me feel unsettled. Never mind my own personal stuff.

Claire 

Now, there’s a lot and you are a woman in the world very much. How do you describe yourself these days? How do you identify like as a person in the world?

Tamara Taggart 

It’s such a good question, Claire. Because most of the time lately, I don’t know. I think I’m somebody who always knew what my purpose was. And I always knew what I wanted to do. And, you know, I was a television news anchor. And I did a lot of volunteering. And I helped raise money, and I had a young family. And so I really felt like my life was well defined. You know, I knew what my career was. I’d been in my career for 28 years. But you know, in 2018, my contract wasn’t renewed after, you know, 22 years at the same station. And it was a blow. And so after that. I had a hard time describing who I am. And I’m not sure. I’m not sure I know who I am yet either. Like, it’s interesting because sometimes I feel, embarrassed. That’s not the right word. But you know, saying that I’m home with my kids. Feels like it’s not I know it’s important and trust me it is. Well, you know, it’s hard. But we live in this society where we’re judged by our CV, right, by what it is that we do. Sometimes it feels not enough to me.

Claire 

Well, I mean, you had this this huge career for so long and it what is it about almost three years exactly that your contract wasn’t renewed? And that was a surprise, correct?

Tamara Taggart 

Blindsided.

Claire 

Can you talk about that a little bit?

Tamara Taggart 

Yeah, I started in television in Vancouver, when I was in my late 20s. And I worked my way up. And, you know, years later, I was anchoring the six o’clock news..

Claire 

Which is a big deal.

Tamara Taggart 

It’s a huge deal. It’s the big job at a television station in Canada. It’s huge.

Claire

I remember coming to visit you for the first time and seeing your face all over town on buses and billboards.

Tamara Taggart

Yeah, and I mean, I loved it. And what I loved about it was all the people that I was around. And so it was such a huge part of who I was, I wasn’t defined by my job, but I was, I was into all the people that I worked with, and the, you know, being the sum of the equation, right? Like we all worked hard all day. And then at six o’clock, there it was, what we all worked on all day long.

Claire  06:19

And you love current events and world events and politics. It was such a part of it, too.

Tamara Taggart

Yeah. And you know that right, I finished the news. And I come home and watch more. And I’m always reading always looking always, because I’m a very curious person. And I love talking to people. And yeah, it was we were doing quite well. And I had been anchoring for seven years. And I grew up in that environment. I had all three of my babies. You know, while I was working in television, and pregnant on magazine covers, and all of that sort of stuff. I had cancer, and it was like it was a part of just everybody knew everything about me. And then it just ended. I went into work in April of 2018. And I walked in. And the second I sat down, there was an email from my boss saying, hey, can you come to my office? Which was an odd because we would have Monday morning meetings. And you know, so I went to his office, left my purse, left my phone, left everything I went and I sat down. And he looked at me, and it was my news director and the assistant news director, who were both my friends.

Tamara Taggart

And he said to me, I’m sorry to tell you, but today’s your last day here. That’s the way he said it. And I was like, what? And he said, I’m sorry to tell you, but today’s your last day. And I said why? He said, well, I’m sorry to tell you this. And I said, why? And he said, well, we need to go upstairs to the boardroom. But I wanted to tell you here first, I was like, okay, well, thanks. So then I had to walk through the entire newsroom with these two guys behind me trying to hold it together and then when I got upstairs, it was you know, human resources is exactly, this never happened to me like that before. And you know, there they all are in the boardroom. And anyways, there was no reason for it. And it was pretty fast. I would say that once I was in the boardroom, it was about, I don’t know, 90 seconds. And as soon as I walked out the door, my email was frozen. My contacts were frozen, my calendar disappeared, everything disappeared. And for me, that’s where I was most distraught. It was so awful, because all of my life was in that little phone. All my kids appointments were in that calendar. All of my son’s doctors were in my contacts. So for me, when I think back to it now. It’s not the job loss so much that hurt me. It was the way it was done. It was so cold and awful. And it hurt me so deeply that it felt like betrayal and abandonment times a thousand. So it was hard to recover from that and I’m not sure I have recovered from it to be honest with you.

Claire 

No, it’s real grief. I remember seeing you shortly after this at my wedding in that same month, and you were you were just in shock still and deeply grieving. How much of it have you come to understand as it having to do with being a woman or age or how many of these like components play into their decision to Well, that’s

Tamara Taggart

interesting that you say that. I would have never thought it had anything to do with that. But it was three weeks before my 50th birthday party or birthday party. It wasn’t a party, birthday. My 50th birthday. You know, it was three weeks before that I was so excited to turn 50, I felt so powerful and confident and I felt like I finally knew who I was and then this happened. So I do think that age has something to do with it for sure. There’s no doubt about it. I was also let go with my co-anchor who is older than me. And, and he found another job in television within weeks, he was approached. And whereas I felt like I was just, you know, forgotten, and I don’t think it really is that way or was that way, but that’s the narrative I had in my head because I was so distraught and so upset and hurt really more hurt. Whereas it didn’t really affect him at all. In that way. I was really hung up on how it was done and how cold it was. Whereas he never really looked at it the same way as me. And I thought that was interesting, too.

Claire  10:42

Yeah. Gosh, just thinking about you going into that 50th birthday and feeling so confident and then to have the rug pulled out from underneath you. What has it looked like to kind of move through this, like this grief? I mean, that’s real grief, losing that kind of career that abruptly.

Tamara Taggart 

Yeah, you know, and it’s interesting, because I never looked at grief that way before. To me, grief was always someone dying, and you being sad. That’s what grief is to me or was to me. And it wasn’t until that happened to me that I started to understand that grief is really complicated. And it comes in so many different ways and forms and, and affects us all so differently. And once I understood that, it was grief that I was feeling, it was a little bit easier to deal with. And to be sad about it. And yeah, and sometimes I’ll have somebody say, like, oh, aren’t you over it? Yeah, like, come on. And I thought that was interesting, too, because it’s not the job that I’m grieving. I’m grieving, my friends that I saw every single day. Like, I went from seeing 100 people every day, to seeing my kids and my husband every day, and I love them. But it led to change, right, to go from one extreme to the other. And then I just felt so isolated. And this was before the pandemic. So I was already feeling so isolated. By the time you know, COVID-19 showed up and we all had to isolate.

Claire  12:20

Was there anything that made it easier? Or did you just really have to push through your own barriers with it?

Tamara Taggart 

I’ve had to really push through it. And also, it was interesting having kids to watch you do this.

Claire 

That was gonna be my next question. How was that?

Tamara Taggart 

Oh, god, it’s hard. Because I now know that everything I do is teaching them how they’ll do it one day. And I knew that from, you know, when my father-in-law died, and it was so devastating to our entire family. And I had to understand how to, I read all these books, you helped with this too, on how to how-to walk-through grief, so that our kids understand it, from an early age, and they’re not ashamed to cry, and they’re not scared to say their feelings, and they’re not. So I had to walk that, you know, that line with my own job loss, I wanted to, you know, I think the first couple of days, I spent a lot of time in bed, just so sad. And yeah, and I probably drank too much wine those first few weeks too. But, you know, a girl’s got to do what a girl’s got to do sometimes when, and you know, and then I and then I did the whole thing that I always do. Okay, it’s time to you know, put on your big girl pants. And let’s, you know, let’s see how this goes. But you can do that. But still way down deep inside. It’s like I was so wounded and, and embarrassed. It’s hard to say that out loud. You know, like I was embarrassed because I did it in front of everybody. It happened in front of everybody.

Claire  14:01

And how do you move through that? You know, I think we’ve all experienced that, on some level, not maybe as large as the level that you went through this because it was also so public, all of a sudden, your job was gone. But I think we’ve all felt those moments of shame and embarrassment, however warranted or irrational they are, we still feel them. And it’s hard to move through those. I think that’s where we have to come in with our own self forgiveness and compassion, which is tough.

Tamara Taggart

It’s really hard. And it what I found so interesting is I would be, you know, out. I remember I was on Granville Street in Vancouver, and I was in a store. And this woman came up to me and she said, Hi, Tamara, and I said, hi. And she goes, I just really liked what you’ve been saying. I think I was like, you know, spurting up my feelings on Instagram a little bit. And she said, I really like what you’ve been saying on Instagram. She goes because I lost my job that I had for 23 years. And you know, I’m in my 50s. And it’s been so hard for me. And I felt like, it’s so isolated and so lonely. And then once I saw that it happened to you, I was like, oh, I’m not the only one. And I think that that’s the way it is for so many things, right? It’s like, you feel like you’re the only person going through whatever it is, but you’re not. And so when other people are able to sort of show their, their insides and how you’re really feeling, it actually helps all of us and I know that I’ve connected with other people, too, that have lost their jobs and, and understood the feelings a little bit better.

Claire 

But that vulnerability piece of like, okay, I’ll go first, I’ll tell you this thing that’s happening with me. But then what it does is how it allows other people to feel okay, about going through it too. It’s really amazing. It’s so powerful.

Claire  16:15

Now, you said that, you know, you did that thing you always do where you’re like, okay, I’m going to put on my big girl pants and get up. And you’ve been through some surprising and hard things in your life before, to going through those things, if you want to talk about them at all, help you go through and yet another life challenge.

Tamara Taggart 

So I was diagnosed with a rare cancer like 10 years ago. And it was you know, I was on TV and all that sort of stuff, and three years of chemo, and it was horrible. And I did nearly die here in our house. And I knew then that nothing else was going to be worse than that. And that’s true. Because the worst thing is dying. Like in my mind,  that was the worst thing that could happen to me. And so I had to remind myself of that, when I was feeling, you know, having a bad day and feeling, you know, maybe jealous of other people’s accomplishments or embarrassed that I couldn’t find another job or whatever it might be that I was feeling that day, whatever stories I had made up in my own head about what was happening to me. And I did have to reflect back to some really tough times. When I had cancer, and it reminded me that, you know, this is another chapter. And this is what I have to remember, cancer was a horrible chapter. But it was a chapter. And I think it was five years in total that or no, it was three years in total that I was on the chemo and the surgery and the whole thing or whatever. And I remember somebody saying to me, Tamara, in your long, beautiful, long, long life, this cancer thing is going to be a tiny little blip. And you will look back on it years and years from now and go yeah, remember that? It won’t be the main story. And they were right. They were right. And so when the job thing happened, I also reminded myself of that, this isn’t what is going to be what defines me, I have much more to give. And I have you know, more stories to tell. And it has helped me reflect on that. You know, and really understand it a little bit more. But, you know, I had a massive anxiety attack. Shortly after I finished my chemo. And I didn’t know what that was like, and I didn’t know what was happening to my body. And that has been the hardest thing I think out of all of it is learning how to navigate depression and anxiety and where it came from and what happens when you don’t let anything out for decades. That’s been hard.

Claire 

And you know, I think sitting with uncertainty, which is something you mentioned at the very top of this, just how do we sit with uncertainty? You know, how do we sit with a life that’s not clearly defined right now? Or we don’t know what’s ahead. I think we’re all doing some version of that just from the pandemic, but some of us are doing that in personal ways as well, you know?

Tamara Taggart 

And I think that security to me is super important. And I don’t like uncertainty. You know, I’m not that person. Like I am definitely like, I have a hard time rolling with the punches. You know, like, I’m not that person. I like to know what’s happening and that and so I’ve had these series have events happen that have really like, tossed everything on its side. So I think I’d be used to it by now. And I think that’s why it was so hard for me. Because I was so determined to be secure, whatever that means, I don’t even know what it means, right? Like, you know, it’s important for me to have, like, you know, to go to have groceries in the house, and it’s important for me, whatever those things are, and I was so scared of not having that when I lost my job, I was so scared of disappointing my family and my husband and my friends and whoever it might be, when really, you know, I realized that it’s just me that I have to answer to at the end of the day. And I am, you know, I am deep down inside a super happy person. But I have really felt unhappy for a few years now.

Claire  20:51

Yeah. I know, it’s so hard when these kind of just completely unexpected life things happen. And suddenly, we don’t feel like ourselves anymore. We don’t recognize who we are. And how do we find that happiness again, and sometimes it’s obvious that the happiness isn’t coming back right away, right? Like it’s gonna take work and time. And so how do we settle into this weird version of ourselves that we’re not really loving and show up anyway, right?

Tamara Taggart 

And, you know, the funny thing was, and I don’t know if it’s funny, haha, funny. But when we were first told that we had to isolate and we weren’t. So I know, it’s different everywhere. But here in British Columbia, we were, you know, there were early on, it was basically don’t leave your house unless you have to go for something essential. For a few weeks. It was it felt like, you know, a long time. I had never been happier. The happiest I’ve ever I think I remember calling you and, and I said, I’m the happiest I’ve ever been in my life. Like, what? Everybody can’t leave their house. Guess what? I haven’t left my house for the last year or two years. This is like okay, so now you’re all like me? Oh, and some people don’t they’re working from home. Okay, this is good. And everybody’s worried about money. Oh, me, too. I’ve been worried about it for a few years now. You know, and all these things. I felt like, oh, finally, everybody else is gonna know what I feel like. And it made me feel happy. But then it’s carried on for so long that I’m like, oh my gosh, like, you know, am I ever gonna get out of my house? That’s how I’ve been feeling lately.

Claire  22:51

So just before the pandemic, you ran for office? Didn’t you? I’m dredging up all of your good stuff. I know you too well, I know all your things.

Tamara Taggart 

I know. So yeah. So I ran in the 2019 federal election. And I gotta tell you, I’ve been thinking about this, I knew you were gonna ask about it. And I’ve really been trying to sort out how I feel about it, and what my true feelings are about it. And I think I can say now that I wish I hadn’t done it. And I’ve never said that about anything in my life, ever. I always say, oh, everything happens for a reason. And, you know, I’m glad I did that. And yeah, maybe it wasn’t my best choice. I kind of wish I’d never done that. Yeah. And my reasons are probably different than most people’s. But I think I tried politics at a time when everything is so divisive. Everything is so you know, it’s either left or right. And there is no center anymore. And, you know, I remember the prime minister saying to me, the second you say yes to this, 50% of people are not going to like you anymore. And I said, well, that’s not true. And he said, It’s true. And he won’t have a reason for it. And I wasn’t prepared for any of that. I wasn’t prepared for how awful some people can be strangers, strangers, and how scary some people can be. And how we will Dave’s a rock and roll musician. I was in TV for so long. And he used to say to me, oh, you TV People make musicians look like choirboys. And I was like, really? And he’s like, oh, yeah, like because you know, TV can be its own thing. Well, politics is completely different. It makes you know, rock and roll and television look like puppies and kittens.

Tamara Taggart 

Oh my God, you’ve got to have a thick skin.

Tamara Taggart 

Well, think I had a pretty thick skin for you know, a lot of things that happened to me and TV.

Claire 

I just mean having recently gone through that job lost. Just to put yourself back in another vulnerable place.

Tamara Taggart 

Like why didn’t someone stop me?

Claire 

That was really, I was like, wow, Tamara is really brave to go right back into that kind of position.

Tamara Taggart 

You know, I thought about it for a long time, too. And I realize that I, yeah, I was too vulnerable to make that decision. And I did not know that at the time. But now I do. And the other reality is, is that it did not help me heal. It did not as a matter of fact, it made things 100 times worse. Because what happened was, is I lost, which I don’t think was a surprise at all in any way, shape, or form. And it wasn’t the losing that I was embarrassed about, or I don’t even know if embarrassed is the right word, it wasn’t that it was I realized I was used. And I and I was I don’t think there’s anybody from you know, who talked me into it that could deny that I was used.

Claire  26:07

All in some political strategy way?

Tamara Taggart

Yeah, you know, I’m, I’m known in Vancouver, and I, you know, I have a reputation of being community person, and fun, kind, you know, volunteer all those things. And then once I said yes, to this, I became evil. And I became, you know, I became all these things that I wasn’t, and just the things that people said about me that I didn’t even know or wrote about me, or the tweets I read, I was just like, oh, my gosh, I’ll never recover from this. Well, I have personally I have, but I will still get it. If I if I am, you know, advocating for something, somebody will always come back and throw that at me that I’m a failed politician or so it’s like, I wasn’t a politician. I was never a politician, you have to, you have to work in politics to be a politician. And I didn’t, I tried running. But I will wear that for some people now. And, and as you know, in both of our countries, politics is just getting worse. It’s not getting better. It is not getting better. It is so difficult. And it’s so difficult for women. And when I see how women are treated in that arena, I just don’t know why any woman would want to put themselves through that. And it shouldn’t be that way. Because we need more women.

Claire 

What are you seeing, what are women having to go through in there that you’re seeing?

Tamara Taggart 

Oh, the name calling and the lies and the character, you know, assassinations that are happening, like it’s just awful. And the threats, like death threats, and you know, violence, and it’s horrible for women?

Claire  28:00

Is there also pressured to be a certain kind of woman or to have certain traits?

Tamara Taggart 

Well, I think that, you know, yeah, that so what I described as what, you know, a certain group of people will say and do about a woman politician or running. But yeah, it’s interesting, you know, it’s like they, what is that saying? Where they say, you’re the, you know, the sacrificial sheep, right? They are lamb, they throw you in into a, you know, a writing or that they know, you’re not gonna win, but you’re a placeholder almost, you know, for certain things. And I’m not saying I was that, but a lot of women are. And, you know, and now with, you know, people, you have to have a certain amount of women and a certain amount of, you know, people of color, and so they attract all these people, yet, I’m not sure that they want those people to actually win.

Claire 

What do you want for your daughter’s thinking about women kind of moving into the world as young adults? Like, what do you? What do you want for them as they navigate the same kind of stuff? Do you have careers and rejection or success and failure?

Tamara Taggart 

That is such a good question. Yeah. Well, you have a boy and two girls instead of why, and it’s, you know, raising girls in this world is, you know, I want to be protective. yet. I also want them to experience you know, and I think I’m too protective sometimes, I always tell them you can be and do whatever it is that you want to do. And let’s try lots of different things and see what you like. And you know, like Zoey came home the other day, and she said, I’m going to try out for the soccer team at school. And I said, oh, that’s amazing. She’s never played soccer in her life. And I said, that’s amazing. I said, because I’m sure she goes to school with kids that can really play soccer. And I said, do you know like what the rules are and stuff? And she goes, oh, yeah. oh, yeah. And I said, Oh, you do? And she said, yeah. And I said, oh, I see you haven’t really played before she goes, yes, I have, I’ve totally played. And I was thinking like that one time I took you when you were two to the park, and she goes, oh, no, I played it in gym. And I was like, okay, and I just thought, I want that confidence. You know, I want that confidence, where it’s like, I’m just gonna try out for this team. And you know what, if she makes it, she’ll be happy. And if she doesn’t make it, she’ll move on. And I love that about her. She’ll just move on. She’s like, oh, well didn’t work out. I gotta try this thing over here. And I love that, because that’s how we should be. You know, that’s what we should tackle everything in life. If I didn’t have the fears I have, what would I you know, if I had Zoe’s attitude? Yeah, I’m just gonna try out for you know, I guess I did kind of have that attitude when I decided politics.

Claire  30:54

I think she may have gotten it from you. I know her, she has a certain Tamara energy to her. Well, in closing, like, what would you say to someone who’s listening who’s just gone through a big job loss too, and they’re just really lost.

Tamara Taggart 

I would say that it’s really important to feel everything. And just like, you know, grief, grief. And you know, when we talk about the different stages of grief, I have felt all of those with my job lost. And I think it’s really important to feel all of those things, to feel the anxiety, and the anger and the sadness, all of those things are really important and hopefully, you’re surrounded by people that let you have those emotions. Because once you can sort of walk through that, it really helps you get to the other side.

Claire 

Well, I can’t wait to see what you do next. All the things you do.

Claire  32:01

I love that Tamara opened up the way she did. I think it can be really easy for people to assume that someone like her has it together all the time. But really, we’re all a work in progress. We all experience hardship and challenges and life changes. And the more we can talk openly about these things, the more we can help each other through them. So for this week’s practice, I want you to think about all the various ways you define yourself and take a look at what those identities are dependent upon. For me, I think about myself in terms of being a mother, a wife, a therapist, an author, what would it be like if one of those identities were taken away from me? And who am I without any of them? Ask yourself, What are the main people, places or circumstances I rely on to define my identity? And then ask yourself, who are you without them? It took Tamara some time to move through the grief of losing her career. But what she discovered was that there were pieces of ourselves she hadn’t even gotten to know, could that be the same for you? Are there undiscovered parts of yourself waiting to be led out into the light, we could all take a little time to get to know ourselves in different ways. In doing so, just might be the thing to get you through that next time when the rug gets pulled out. To go a little deeper with some of this, I recommend Pema Chödrön’s When Things Fall Apart, a great book about how to sit with uncertainty, healing after job loss 100 practical ideas by Alan D. Wolfelt and Kirby J. Duvall. And lastly, the 52-week inspirational journal, find your spark soul searching prompts and encouraging exercises to get inspired, a year of reflections journal. As always, thanks for listening. And if you get a chance, send me a question through my new online forum at bit.ly/newdayask, it’s totally anonymous. You can literally ask me anything and you can find the link in the show notes. Or if you just want to tell me about one of your weekly practices, call and leave me a voicemail at 8334-LEMONADA, that’s 833-453-6662, or email me at newday@lemonadamedia.com

CREDITS

NEW DAY is a Lemonada Media Original. The show is produced by Jackie Danziger, Liliana Maria Percy Ruiz and Erianna Jiles. Kat Yore is our engineer. Music is by Hannis Brown. Executive producers are Stephanie Wittels Wachs, Jessica Cordova Kramer, Lily Cornell Silver and Claire Bidwell Smith. NEW DAY is produced in partnership with the Well Being Trust, The Jed Foundation and Education Development Center. Help others find our show by leaving us a rating and writing a review. Follow us at @LemonadaMedia across all social platforms, or find me at clairebidwellsmith.com. Join our Facebook group to connect with me and fellow NEW DAY listeners at facebook.com/groups/newdaypod. You can also get bonus content and behind the scenes material by subscribing to Lemonada Premium. You can subscribe right now on the Apple podcast app by clicking on our podcast logo and then the subscribe button. Thanks for listening. See you next week.